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10 deer laying in the back, not one over 50-70 pounds dressed, all shot in the morning on drives. He informed me that the majority were button bucks.
Serious question, WHY do people do this? I've never understood it. It's not like you're getting much meat off them. Is it as simple as people simply having absolutely no self-restraint?

Most guys wouldn't be shooting these small deer if they had to check them in
Excellent point. Guys wouldn't shoot fetuses because they would feel SHAME if they had to check them in. Never thought of that.

It's not just deer hunting that has gone downhill, what about upland bird hunting? The state is devoid of a huntable native bird population these days. No habitat, no birds. Worse, no interest from the Division since it's not a moneymaker.
Ehhh,,,,, you realize it was the out-of-control deer population that destroyed much of the bird habitat? Ruffed Grouse etc.....
 
Great post, Mike. I'm out of words to voice my concerns on this stupidity. The place where I met you when I gave your boys the tapes used to be a check station. I saw that same pick up bed full of young deer over and ever again through the years. I said it back then and continue to to say it today. We are the keepers of the herd, but unfortunately, there are those who are only in it for their own selfish greed. They pound their chest as if they accomplished something. They have no clue to the damage done. I don't know what else to say about the ignorance.
 
I'm not reading the whole tread but without knowing where they shot them STFU. So areas need that kind of management and some don't .. Arm chair biologist get old real quick
What management of a deer herd includes the killing of button bucks?
 
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Discussion starter · #25 ·
I'm not reading the whole tread but without knowing where they shot them STFU. So areas need that kind of management and some don't .. Arm chair biologist get old real quick
What has gotten old is is the same old crap of just turn your back, the state sells the permits so why not shoot everything. I have a good idea who they club is and no, they aren't shooting deer on a farmer crop damage permit. As for arm chair biologists, when you've lived in an area your whole life, hunted, trapped and fished countless hours in these woods you don't need a paper degree to see what's been shaking out. And further more, incidents like these where deer are just shot indiscriminately is happening statewide, that is a fact.
I will not sit back any longer and watch this, many will continue to choose to put there heads in the sand and ignore it and that's there choice.
The mentality of "well, if I don't shoot it the guys on the adjacent properties will" is such a sh$t talking point.
I plan on meeting with representatives from the Sportsmen's Federation to discuss the deer permit issues and a few other regulation proposals.
Sitting back and letting it take its course will be the demise of our deer hunting here in NJ as we know it, I want to see my kids and their kids to have better opportunity's than I had.
 
I have a foot on both sides of the fence here. The property in NY where they trophy hunt, the rule is 10 points or better, Period. doesn't matter bow, gun or muzzleloader, NO Does or fawns. BUT the owner has green fields, puts in all the minerals and nutrients to grow the big boys, and assures the survival of the herd with supplemental food if the winter is tough.

The other property Is the opposite, shoot the does first and leave the guys with horns alone, and hopefully the neighboring properties will shoot them as they don't have deprivation permits. in a tough year the deer will eat the bark off the trees and he looses a lot of his income. He would rather let hunters take what they can first, so the meat is not wasted, because if he shoots them, most stay where they drop till spring.

It all about management, unfortunately I see both extremes.

If the deer were taken on a WMA, then it's a shame!
 
What has gotten old is is the same old crap of just turn your back, the state sells the permits so why not shoot everything. I have a good idea who they club is and no, they aren't shooting deer on a farmer crop damage permit. As for arm chair biologists, when you've lived in an area your whole life, hunted, trapped and fished countless hours in these woods you don't need a paper degree to see what's been shaking out. And further more, incidents like these where deer are just shot indiscriminately is happening statewide, that is a fact.
I will not sit back any longer and watch this, many will continue to choose to put there heads in the sand and ignore it and that's there choice.
The mentality of "well, if I don't shoot it the guys on the adjacent properties will" is such a sh$t talking point.
I plan on meeting with representatives from the Sportsmen's Federation to discuss the deer permit issues and a few other regulation proposals.
Sitting back and letting it take its course will be the demise of our deer hunting here in NJ as we know it, I want to see my kids and their kids to have better opportunity's than I had.

I COULD NOT POSSIBLY AGREE MORE!!!! BRAVO [up]
 
I think that the bear population is affecting the deer population to some extent, so the 88-pounder is a non-issue to me.

Sounds like the Allamuchy Gun Club. I know for a fact that as of Wednesday night they had 12 deer, mostly does and button bucks. Yes, I am posting their name to shame them. Hey AGC - how about not shitting where you eat. Morons.
These guys ruined buck week. Ever since I was a little kid this club pounded every piece of land..permission or not ..and buckshot as many yearlings they can. Bunch of savages.
 
What management of a deer herd includes the killing of button bucks?
Any farm that the habitat has reached or went beyond its carring capacity ..

ok, If we do agree that you don't need a degree to manage deer herd can we agree that at least you need some facts/data and not just a pickup truck full of deer ?
 
If you want a change, its going to be up to the hunters to make the change. The division in Mr. Roberts words manages for all citizens not just hunters. With 25000 vehicle deer strikes in NJ, you can bet insurance companies are having an influence. As long as we buy their bs permits, shotgun, muzzleloader, buck stubs, things will remain as they are now. As long as guys are willing to buy a buck stub to kill a little basket rack 8pt, things won't change. As long as we keep feeding the division money they will keep things as they are. I love hunting as much as the next guy, but I've had enough, and spend my money in other states. They can take their deer program and jam it.
 
Careful what you wish for, you just may get it!!! Cause once you shorten the seasons you'll never get it back, bank on it. I would go only as far as reevaluating unlimited in certain areas, and if needed adjust the bag limits, but I will oppose a shortening of the season in any way, you address population with bag limits. Understand that if we start advocating for shorter bow seasons the antis will jump on board to make it really short, and no one wants that, drop the emotion here and let facts and science determine what's best.
 
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