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There is a separate course for muzzy,why "it's just another gun".
For one It's a RIFLE, not a Shotgun , DUH

Muzzleloading RIFLE

You do not need to take the ML class to use a Muzzleloading SHOTGUN
WOW ONCE AGAIN, That sounds just like the exact point we are making to you and the F&G, Paul [wallmad]

It is now clear that you do get it but for some reason are choosing to ignore and deny this simple fact for reason unknown to us [spy]


Crossbows though a form of archery equipment are not actual bows [eyeroll]

Just in the same exact way that muzzys though GUNS are not actual shotguns


So they the (F&G) have rightfully "separated" each into there own appropriate PERMIT seasonand required differing hunter safety courses with weapons safety and proficiency testing ;)
They are clearly not all just lumped into each others seasons since each one possess a clearly easily achieved greater capability them the other.

Even with all your well thought out double talk, it all just keeps circling back to prove the very point we are making here.
 
How about the FACT that NO OTHER STATE has ever instituted "RETRO" training for their ALREADY LICENSED" bow Hunters that choose to us a CrossBOW ?

And NONE have seen an increase in Bow Hunting "accidents" after CrossBOWS were permitted........

So are you saying that the Licensed Bow Hunters in NJ are a bunch of reckless, unsafe, wackos that need SPECIAL training ?

Training (retro) that has been shown NOT to be needed in any other State.
Have you figured out how to get around this one ?

Oh that's RIGHT. NJ IS NOT LIKE EVERY OTHER STATE. OUR BOW HUNTERS ARE ?

a bunch of reckless, unsafe, wackos that need SPECIAL training ?
 
Have you figured out how to get around this one ?

Oh that's RIGHT. NJ IS NOT LIKE EVERY OTHER STATE.
Now You Got [up] Like I said your double talk just makes our points valid over and over again, just to see one of the easily proven difference between Jersey and other less densely populated states;
Just go to any of your local sports stores here in New Jersey and see if you can walk in and simply buy a rifle or shotgun with just your Drivers license, just like you can in just about every other state in our countryFOR THAT FACT JUST SIMPLY TRY AND BUY A BB GUN WITH ONLY A DL in other states you don't need nothing but cash to buy a simple BB gun , you can't Why because Jersey Is NOT like every other state out there and there are reasons for it, we may not agree with most of the gun law and other laws here in Jersey as they are dumb to us and make no sense at all, but they are the law and make things here different for us all That's just one example of how things are done differently here in Jersey so you can't use the model of every other state dose this or dose that this ain't every other state Paul :p

OUR BOW HUNTERS ARE ?
FOR THE MOST PART PRETTY MUCH UNITED AGAINST CROSSBOWS USE IN ARCHERY SEASON [eyeroll]

SIMPLY PUT ;
CROSSBOWS Don't belong in BOW season and "should" indeed require ALL user to take a permit safety course and buy a certificate permit of use just like a muzzy.
They should also be used in there own Permit NOVEMBER season or if you have taken and passed your course and bought the use certificate permit then you should be able to use them in all open guns seasons [up]
 
For one It's a RIFLE, not a Shotgun , DUH

Muzzleloading RIFLE

You do not need to take the ML class to use a Muzzleloading SHOTGUN
Oh so that's the big differance,don't they both have the capability to shoot saboted slugs thru a "rifled" barrel with the same effective range. But just because YOU feel a xbow is the same as a bow that becomes gospel. NS911 sometimes you crack me up. You must be drinking out of Aces glass,cause you definatly caught something. The wedge your driving is all about you,nothing more nothing less.
 
The wedge your driving is all about you,nothing more nothing less.
and maybe some other reason why such a big push that hasnt been uncovered YET[spy]
 
MENDHAM TWP. — A Massachusetts man was arrested and another still at large after township police nabbed the duo for poaching deer.


Robert Adams, 39, of Lake Pleasant, Mass. was charged Thursday with possession of an illegal weapon — a crossbow

Abrusci said the crossbow is a dangerous, preloaded, point-and-shoot weapon that has a trigger that shoots an arrow similar to how a gun would discharge a bullet
Damn ! ! ! Paul that's gotta sting [hihi][hihi][hihi]
 
The whole article...

Robert Adams, 39, of Lake Pleasant, Mass. was charged Thursday with possession of an illegal weapon — a crossbow — as well as possession of hunting knifes. He was additionally charged with four hunting violations by the New Jersey Division of Fish, Game and Wildlife, Sgt. Vito Abrusci said. Adams’ hunting partner, also from Massachusetts, fled the scene, Abrusci said.

At around 2:09 a.m., Thursday, patrolman Vinnie Pagano pulled over a cargo van driving without lights in the area of Wysong Park, behind the old Ralston Firehouse on Route 24, Abrusci said. Pagano seized two bows from the men — the illegal crossbow and a legal compound bow — and approximately 50 arrows, knives and binoculars. According to Abrusci, the men were getting ready to cut open a male, 8-point antlered deer.

“We haven’t figured out why they decided to poach deer in Mendham Township,” Abrusci said, noting his department is still investigating, along with the New Jersey Division of Fish, Game and Wildlife and the Morris County Sheriff’s Department, whose canine unit assisted the night of the incident.

“We’re trying to find out what brought them to our area. There’s obviously a reason why they ended up here to hunt,” Abrusci said.

According to Abrusci, hunting is not allowed after dark in New Jersey, nor in proximity to residences. In this situation, he said the men likely killed the deer within 450 feet of a residential area.

Abrusci said the crossbow is a dangerous, preloaded, point-and-shoot weapon that has a trigger that shoots an arrow similar to how a gun would discharge a bullet.

Adams was released with a Dec. 10 court date on $5,000 cash bail after spending eight hours at the Morris County jail, Abrusci said.

Though Adams was uncooperative in divulging information about the other man, Abrusci said the subject was identified but his name cannot be disclosed.
Pagano seized two bows from the men — the illegal crossbow and a legal compound bow — and approximately 50 arrows, knives and binoculars.
Hummmm.........

Doesn't say whether the CrossBOW or the Compound was used.

The CrossBOW is currently ILLEGAL to hunt with in NJ, but the COMPOUND is ALSO IILEGAL if used for poaching.

We've never said that CrossBOWS were NEVER used for Poaching. They are not the CHOICE of POACHERS.
Most statistics from F&G Agencies(including NJ) show that the .22cal Rifle is the preferred weapon.

After all, using any TYPE of BOW, for poaching is just asking to be caught. Arrows take time to KILL, and a Poacher doesn't want to be tracking an illegally shot deer, and drawing attention.
A .22 to the head, dead on the spot..........
 
Abrusci said the crossbow is a dangerous, preloaded, point-and-shoot weapon that has a trigger that shoots an arrow similar to how a gun would discharge a bullet
Can't get away from the TRUTH :p [hihi][hihi][hihi]
 
Oh that's RIGHT. NJ IS NOT LIKE EVERY OTHER STATE. OUR BOW HUNTERS ARE ?


Quote:
a bunch of reckless, unsafe, wackos that need SPECIAL training ?
Sure I'll say it....

Some of the bowhunters probably are. Also a "majority" (I noticed we use that word a lot more loosely these days);) of the firearm hunters probably are.

Lets face it, we live in a state chock full of idiots.

Giving those same idiots a "dangerous, preloaded, point-and-shoot weapon that has a trigger that shoots an arrow similar to how a gun would discharge a bullet", without requiring hunter orange AND a special safety course is just asking for trouble.


Image


I've already decided not to hunt NJ anymore after the full inclusion. I will buy a NYS license. I'm encouraging other bowhunters I know to do the same.

I disagree with almost everything this state does pertaining to hunting, so they will not see another dime from me. Enough is enough.

They can take their multi-weapon seasons, their screwed up regulations, their emotionally-based game management and obsurd resident license, permit and buck tag fees and stick them right where the sun don't shine![up][up]



Huh...interesting: http://www.newjerseyhunter.com/article47825.htm
 
Most statistics from F&G Agencies(including NJ) show that the .22cal Rifle is the preferred weapon.
And as YOU have said before"times are changing" and with houses closer in proximaty to roads that are busier and the "quiet" approach being more useful to criminals the xbow is gaining popularity by them. Make them legal for everyone and poachers will have them in their vehicals all the time. BTW,the desert stryker can be shot thru a window easily and it can penetrate a skull with ease.
 
I've already decided not to hunt NJ anymore after the full inclusion. I will buy a NYS license. I'm encouraging other bowhunters I know to do the same.

I disagree with almost everything this state does pertaining to hunting, so they will not see another dime from me. Enough is enough.

They can take their multi-weapon seasons, their screwed up regulations, their emotionally-based game management and obsurd resident license, permit and buck tag fees and stick them right where the sun don't shine

wow paul you were right crossbows are GREAT for hunter retention[eyeroll]...and there will be many more to follow matty's path you can bank on that;)

paul your greed and stubbornness is gonna bite you later..your selfishness for maybe an alternative gain is gonna kill our sport and you my friend can thank yourself you should be proud[down]
 
you my friend can thank yourself
I agree Paul SHOULD be proud for what he has done with the crossbow issue. He stood up and did the right thing not only for the majority of hunters (per the F&G poll) also the 50% of your fellow members in the UBNJ!! Thanks Paul for a job WELL DONE!!

PS: Just ignore the minority whining!![up][cry]
 
Hey tim, how's it goin buddy. Ace let you off the leash?

Paul should also be proud of what he has done to hunter unity in NJ. I tell you the UXBNJ is doing a fabulous job.[eyeroll][eyeroll][eyeroll][down][down][down]
 
Is this issue going up for public comment at all, or is it a done deal?
you can comment, but the backyard bbq's made it basically a done deal
 
your supposed to be about retention randolph remember[lol]
 
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