In case you haven't read the new summer UBNJ magazine I would like to inform you that you just lost the privelege to bowhunt on any managment hunts with this bowhunting organization, if you do not possess a FID card, thats right a FIREARMS ID CARD. You've got to be kidding me. This means if you bowhunt only and don't wish to gun hunt or for one reason or another you are don't wish to you will be forced to obtain one of the cards to participate in one of these hunts. Not to mention the nightmare it is to obtain one of these cards. Also if you and your family are members, you won't be able to hunt. Unless you have this card. Plus, (like me) I'm sure not all of the members have been goodie two shoes all of there lives, and may have made a mistake or two in there life,you will not be able to obtian one of these cards. I sent an e-mail to the president of the club, Jim Mills and he responded by saying I quote, "We realize that this is a bowhunting organization first & formost, however some of the property owners we are working with from time to time request gun hunts to more quickly reduce the deer population. With concerns for the great liability associated with these hunts. The leadership felt it to be in the best interest and future security of the organization to require this vital piece of documentation." Give me a brake, thats what insurance is for. The state of NJ as a whole does'nt require you to have an FID card to hunt, what makes these hunts so different other than making it nearly impossible to hunt these properties. REMEMBER, If it is ever required to buy your next bow to have a FID card, you can always thank UBNJ
Attention all UBNJ Members
luvtahunt
81 - 100 of 114 Posts
Its been said earlier in this thread... if they quit because of this its probably the only reason they joined in the first place. Sooo no big loss...
No I'm not... and actualy now I cant hunt the lands unless I get a FID...do I care... yea am I mad and think its an inside job... you would have to be a retard to think something like that.
Don't think its grounds to quit because of the FID issue because there's plenty that is done that is good but we will see what happens next now that the door is opened wider.
I'm glad you cleared that up Mark I didn't think you would be in favor. Just what we need more to get tougher. Yeah so what does a nonresident do? They comply with out of state regulations to hunt but now do they in NJ unless they have the FID?
I'm glad you cleared that up Mark I didn't think you would be in favor. Just what we need more to get tougher. Yeah so what does a nonresident do? They comply with out of state regulations to hunt but now do they in NJ unless they have the FID?
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Cat you made many good points and a few off the wall. First off fellow UBNJ members get mad if you must, I have no dog in the hunt. I hunt my own land, never have ,never will apply for a UBNJ hunt. The FID requirement is a bad decision without input from all the membership. Its a major beauracratic shift. It affects not only UBNJ but other county hunts that might follow suit thanks to this decision. Countless bow only hunters thruout the state will thank you. I am commenting on what I have read here. One host required it[confused] and wants gun hunts. Hey what happened to saying no, sorry this is a bow hunting organization. Access to a hunt will be won at any price even if you have to break out the guns.Many a business has gone under accepting bad terms and this is a far reaching decision that some can't seem to grasp. Its more exclusion than inclusion. This is not a putdown of all the volunteers and time to build up the hunting community just the exact opposite is the end result of this decision- exclusion[down] Not Unity[down] Whats next, DNA?
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While I do not hunt any UBNJ properties, I have been and continue to be involved in negotiations for my club with townships opening properties for bow and gun hunts. All require a FID card and a background check, along with a large insurance policy, hold harmless agreements and a ton of other hoops to jump through. It's a sign of the times to be able to hunt formerly off limit properties.
Those that choose to apply and comply with the requirements have been very happy[up].
It's a pain, but well worth the effort.
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will the FID be required for any UBNJ hunt or just the hunts where the landowner said it was his requirement?>?????
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6,147 Posts
Its pretty simple, if they didn't comply with the request for a FID card UBNJ wouldn't be allowed to hunt the property. They didn't have alot to say about it.
Its the same as a farmer requiring a hunter to do cleanup, or help bale hay before granting permission.
How many of you do things your wife wants, to get a little affection. Same deal, you wanna play you have to abide by the rules the panty wearer or the landowner has set.
This don't have anything to do with Volunteer bashing as some would like to view it and cloud an issue what so ever. Who ever won't stand up against Bureaucratic methouds like this shouldn't have been allowed to make those types of decisions without checking with the entire organization? Whats good for the goose is not neccesarrily good for the gander. I think that was in my nursery ryhm book many moons ago.
I just thought this morning that Nevin is going to profit off this as well because now there will be some who will need some fixing to take place with these BS laws while taking away a heritage that we once had because of some yuppie decision and high preasure tactic to gain access to maybe one property.
I wonder if Fred Bear would have made that decision? Doubt it they would have done something else. Just wait and see what happens is what it is now and its to late but for future things like this that will effect the fate of our heritage someone has to stop these senseless decisions and present them to all those that this could effect other than a few it would benifit in an organization.
What say you men hows this going to be stopped so they don't do this again and again and again?
UBNJ already herd the voice of a few here and I suspect there is many, many others that are against this so here's your chance to speak up. Affraid to call attention to yourself well maybe but unless you stand for what you beleive then you won't change the things that will go down in history. I hope this won't be known as a bad decission that opened the door to ruin the fate of bow hunting that allowed guns because of the FID minipulation on one property that extended to all other propertys!
Now that the guns are involved some people will be up in arms more and require more restrictions possibly.
When you tell people you bow hunt they usally automatically think oh not to bad, not much noise, no lead flying around and no orange army behind every tree but it can go on and on the things we can or I can think up.
The off the wall stuff I said was to get some of you to laugh and have fun in a disturbing situation as I see it that will or might effect the fate of the state in the future.
Now the UBNJ is lobbying for Sunday hunting and the last thing someone will want to here while their family is having a nice breakfast is boom because the guns of Autumn have been brought in. Maybe if it was just bow they won't hear the boom because of silent death if the Sunday hunting is eventually passed.
Now the FID gives you the right to use the boom stick on UBNJ propertys that are now boom propertys or just a couple. You choose how to look at this either positive or negative.
Is there anything positive about it why yes I beleive there are some things that are valid but there are negatives as well and I don't see that when this decision to stand up under our heritaige rights were challanged. They were viewed as heres an opertunity to gain more property and maybe the mind set was, Oh its a privlage to hunt this property so we will comply.
Seems to me that the hired guns are going to be used is a strong probability to get ride of the deer problem because the same guys who are against shooting does will be on them that trophy hunt only?
I guess the conspiracy continues. This is not against the NJUB its against the decision that was made without consulting the general membership!
Now the membership can ask who was responcible to change the fate of the bow only organization and allow guns in on the propertys that are supposed to have been bow manaiged. Because of 1 property now the FID was implemented and that friends is going to be restriction to anyone without the FID.[smirk]
I just thought this morning that Nevin is going to profit off this as well because now there will be some who will need some fixing to take place with these BS laws while taking away a heritage that we once had because of some yuppie decision and high preasure tactic to gain access to maybe one property.
I wonder if Fred Bear would have made that decision? Doubt it they would have done something else. Just wait and see what happens is what it is now and its to late but for future things like this that will effect the fate of our heritage someone has to stop these senseless decisions and present them to all those that this could effect other than a few it would benifit in an organization.
What say you men hows this going to be stopped so they don't do this again and again and again?
UBNJ already herd the voice of a few here and I suspect there is many, many others that are against this so here's your chance to speak up. Affraid to call attention to yourself well maybe but unless you stand for what you beleive then you won't change the things that will go down in history. I hope this won't be known as a bad decission that opened the door to ruin the fate of bow hunting that allowed guns because of the FID minipulation on one property that extended to all other propertys!
Now that the guns are involved some people will be up in arms more and require more restrictions possibly.
When you tell people you bow hunt they usally automatically think oh not to bad, not much noise, no lead flying around and no orange army behind every tree but it can go on and on the things we can or I can think up.
The off the wall stuff I said was to get some of you to laugh and have fun in a disturbing situation as I see it that will or might effect the fate of the state in the future.
Now the UBNJ is lobbying for Sunday hunting and the last thing someone will want to here while their family is having a nice breakfast is boom because the guns of Autumn have been brought in. Maybe if it was just bow they won't hear the boom because of silent death if the Sunday hunting is eventually passed.
Now the FID gives you the right to use the boom stick on UBNJ propertys that are now boom propertys or just a couple. You choose how to look at this either positive or negative.
Is there anything positive about it why yes I beleive there are some things that are valid but there are negatives as well and I don't see that when this decision to stand up under our heritaige rights were challanged. They were viewed as heres an opertunity to gain more property and maybe the mind set was, Oh its a privlage to hunt this property so we will comply.
Seems to me that the hired guns are going to be used is a strong probability to get ride of the deer problem because the same guys who are against shooting does will be on them that trophy hunt only?
I guess the conspiracy continues. This is not against the NJUB its against the decision that was made without consulting the general membership!
Now the membership can ask who was responcible to change the fate of the bow only organization and allow guns in on the propertys that are supposed to have been bow manaiged. Because of 1 property now the FID was implemented and that friends is going to be restriction to anyone without the FID.[smirk]
What kind of a relationship is that your refering to? A minipulation where she uses affection as a weapon.
We should do things for our wife because we love her and its for her well being that we do these not for what we get out of it.
This decision was a tool that was used and if it cuts our nose off to spite our face, so what I guess then?
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6,147 Posts
Fred Bear lived in a different time. Things were alot different then. Things are alot different than when I was a youngster. I am pushing up against 60 now, when I was a kid, we had plenty of land to hunt. We used to walk down the street carrying our uncased guns to go hunting.
If the UBNJ would have put this out for a general membership consensus the outcome would have been the same. There are how many members of UBNJ? Only about 10-12 on this site raising hell. The only difference would have been the headaches the board would get listening to all the people that misunderstood what this requirement is, and the delay because of the explanations, and waiting for the vote.
Come to think of it, how many people vote in UBNJ elections, how many go to meetings.
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6,147 Posts
As a man, that is always in the back of your head. HMMMM, she wants to go to the flower show....maybe I will get alittle extra if I go. I know I ain getting any, if I blow off the flower show and go fishin.
Yup, they do hold it over ya. Obviously ol Cat ain married.
In a perfect world she would hand out favors to her man 24/7, but that don't happen at least at my house. (oops, our house)
Whiskers your last Quote, hit the NAIL RIGHT ON THE HEAD, just what we could thank our bow hunting bow hunting organization for if this were to become a reality. More laws, like to see how well UBNJ does fighting this one if it were to become a reality. Would be like pissing in the wind, like I said earlier this was about a huge loss in focuse in a big way and like some suggested about greed and selfishness. And yet WE have'nt and suspect, WE won't here an apology on this matter. Would like to thank all for there input and thoughts on this matter, didn't think I was at all, OFF base for posting this issue. Needed to be addressed. A special thanks to CAT, whose views are a little harsh at times, but very well put. Issues like this are very sensitive and should be addressed accordingly, and we have every right to be concerned when the organization we support starts making dissisions for us without our input.
Nope Cat aint married right now that's correct after ruining 2 women I had to learn the hard way. When they said I better hope all my animals kept me warn at night when they were gone,I told them all I need is my dog goodbye nice knowing ya. 16 years the first and 12 the second.Half a life time and paying the entire life for it, wasn't to smart on my behalf.
Now more women than I know what to do with and still aint what I wanted. I mis the 1rst one greatly.
Ok back to NJUB your right what if this or that and yes we are in differant times but these are the times of trouble not minipulation times to get what you want at the stake of walking over others.
I fully understand the possition that lead to the NJUB decision but at least can they knock on the front door rather than jimmy the back door while your a sleep in bed wanting to get up in the morning to hunt or fish?
Ok I'm harsh and beleive me I pay for it everyday of my life that I am because I'm a peice of work? I mean a work in progress that is.
I was rough on this one but the fact does remain the door is opened to things that might get further out of control.
There's no need to quit an organization that works and is a good thing but I hope after all the BS settles there can be good out of this and a benifit for all not just a few that will reap immediate benifits.
This is not to start any fights and then leave a pile of bad fellings and hatred.
Whiskers I was just joking with you man and I fully know whats expected with the dames and said that to use it to cut the hearts of men who don't naturally love there wives.I was speaking of myself and had to learn from it and lost 2 life times over it that sucks.
Ok the only other way out now is to get a FID so we all have to comply because its coming anyway like Grant took Richmond.[hihi][hihi][hihi]
Now more women than I know what to do with and still aint what I wanted. I mis the 1rst one greatly.
Ok back to NJUB your right what if this or that and yes we are in differant times but these are the times of trouble not minipulation times to get what you want at the stake of walking over others.
I fully understand the possition that lead to the NJUB decision but at least can they knock on the front door rather than jimmy the back door while your a sleep in bed wanting to get up in the morning to hunt or fish?
Ok I'm harsh and beleive me I pay for it everyday of my life that I am because I'm a peice of work? I mean a work in progress that is.
I was rough on this one but the fact does remain the door is opened to things that might get further out of control.
There's no need to quit an organization that works and is a good thing but I hope after all the BS settles there can be good out of this and a benifit for all not just a few that will reap immediate benifits.
This is not to start any fights and then leave a pile of bad fellings and hatred.
Whiskers I was just joking with you man and I fully know whats expected with the dames and said that to use it to cut the hearts of men who don't naturally love there wives.I was speaking of myself and had to learn from it and lost 2 life times over it that sucks.
Ok the only other way out now is to get a FID so we all have to comply because its coming anyway like Grant took Richmond.[hihi][hihi][hihi]
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You tell em CAT and I will take your word on the thing about Grant since I'm told that you are the only one here who was actualy THERE TO SEE IT HAPPEN!
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3,014 Posts
Guys not to get into it with anyone, but several factors are not being presented here!
1. Most of the guys who are complaining about never getting a FID card for a management hunt are complaining because they CAN'T get one! They did something besides a "little mistake" that they cannot get expunged. What they're not telling you is the truth, why they can't get an FID card.
2. If you knew the truth why they can't get an FID card you would know that they are not legally allowed to carry ANY type of weapon PERIOD! That's right if you've been turned down by the police for an FID card because of a so called "little mistake", you'll find that they are not allowed to possess a bow, a knife,a Samuri Sword, nothing!!!! This is why they don't want to get a card because they'll find out that they are hunting illegally, possessing a weapon they're not supposed to have!
3. A FID card weeds out these "little mistake" makers that shouldn't have a bow in their hands in the first place! That bowhunt because they can't purchase a gun, they're flying under the radar! This is our way of catching them, we pride ourselves on using the best of the best citizens/bowhunters,
4. We try to limit the amount of gun hunting we do, we talk to entities about just using bowhunting, but sometimes other outside influences convince the host to use guns to quickly trim the herds. We succumb to these pressures, because if we don't do it someone else will! In the hopes that we can convince and we usually do the host to maintain with bowhunting only. It's a bitter pill we swallow, in order to show bowhunting can and will do the job.
5. I'm sure the "little mistake" makers don't want everyone to know the truth, so they'll stir the pot a little bit, unfortunately this isn't the forum to do it, we have a Central & Southern Region Meeting coming up, do it there in front of other people, do it in public where we can see your face and you can see ours, not hiding behind a computer monitor, or are you afraid we'll find out about your "little mistake"????
6. Criticism is fine, it's a tool to help you grow, to learn from your mistakes, Criticism is fine as long as it's not malicious. We are volunteers, we work long and hard for the bowhunters of this state, we're not perfect and we may makes some mistakes or you may not agree with everything we do, but always look at the big picture, we're here to protect your right to bowhunt, first and foremost, NOTHING ELSE! Everything else is just a perk for you! the ability to hunt UBNJ Management hunts is a privilage, and it's not for everyone, some people are not cut out for management hunts, they cannot follow rules, they don't want to be told they can't shoot a buck before they shoot 2 does, they can't follow instructions or fail to give us the proper credentials!
7. On the applications we asked for the SS# and many people refused to give it to us, they were worried about Identity Theft, which means we couldn't do a background check on them, Again I ask were they worried about Itentity Theft or someone finding out about their "little mistake".
8. The FID card has become a requirement of the host and our insurance company.
9. Give me a brake, thats what insurance is for, This is the most irresponsible quote in the whole thread, what are you saying let's let some lawbreakers into our hunt and if they shoot up a house don't worry we 've got insurance! Do you tell your kid, don't worry boy, you can have a few beers and drive as fast as you want, we've got insurance!
That's a load of crap!
10. Listen, members who really want to have a dialogue on this can call me we'll talk man to man, "little mistake" makers, if you can't get an FID because you can't get one, I certainly don't want you in one of our hunts, and if that's the only reason you joined UBNJ, I don't want you in our organization either!
1. Most of the guys who are complaining about never getting a FID card for a management hunt are complaining because they CAN'T get one! They did something besides a "little mistake" that they cannot get expunged. What they're not telling you is the truth, why they can't get an FID card.
2. If you knew the truth why they can't get an FID card you would know that they are not legally allowed to carry ANY type of weapon PERIOD! That's right if you've been turned down by the police for an FID card because of a so called "little mistake", you'll find that they are not allowed to possess a bow, a knife,a Samuri Sword, nothing!!!! This is why they don't want to get a card because they'll find out that they are hunting illegally, possessing a weapon they're not supposed to have!
3. A FID card weeds out these "little mistake" makers that shouldn't have a bow in their hands in the first place! That bowhunt because they can't purchase a gun, they're flying under the radar! This is our way of catching them, we pride ourselves on using the best of the best citizens/bowhunters,
4. We try to limit the amount of gun hunting we do, we talk to entities about just using bowhunting, but sometimes other outside influences convince the host to use guns to quickly trim the herds. We succumb to these pressures, because if we don't do it someone else will! In the hopes that we can convince and we usually do the host to maintain with bowhunting only. It's a bitter pill we swallow, in order to show bowhunting can and will do the job.
5. I'm sure the "little mistake" makers don't want everyone to know the truth, so they'll stir the pot a little bit, unfortunately this isn't the forum to do it, we have a Central & Southern Region Meeting coming up, do it there in front of other people, do it in public where we can see your face and you can see ours, not hiding behind a computer monitor, or are you afraid we'll find out about your "little mistake"????
6. Criticism is fine, it's a tool to help you grow, to learn from your mistakes, Criticism is fine as long as it's not malicious. We are volunteers, we work long and hard for the bowhunters of this state, we're not perfect and we may makes some mistakes or you may not agree with everything we do, but always look at the big picture, we're here to protect your right to bowhunt, first and foremost, NOTHING ELSE! Everything else is just a perk for you! the ability to hunt UBNJ Management hunts is a privilage, and it's not for everyone, some people are not cut out for management hunts, they cannot follow rules, they don't want to be told they can't shoot a buck before they shoot 2 does, they can't follow instructions or fail to give us the proper credentials!
7. On the applications we asked for the SS# and many people refused to give it to us, they were worried about Identity Theft, which means we couldn't do a background check on them, Again I ask were they worried about Itentity Theft or someone finding out about their "little mistake".
8. The FID card has become a requirement of the host and our insurance company.
9. Give me a brake, thats what insurance is for, This is the most irresponsible quote in the whole thread, what are you saying let's let some lawbreakers into our hunt and if they shoot up a house don't worry we 've got insurance! Do you tell your kid, don't worry boy, you can have a few beers and drive as fast as you want, we've got insurance!
That's a load of crap!
10. Listen, members who really want to have a dialogue on this can call me we'll talk man to man, "little mistake" makers, if you can't get an FID because you can't get one, I certainly don't want you in one of our hunts, and if that's the only reason you joined UBNJ, I don't want you in our organization either!
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3,014 Posts
Finally, about 3 years ago I went to the Monmouth County Park System to obtain a permit with my new Hunter Education Safety Certificate, even though I was an instructor for 22 years, they wanted my certificate not my Hunter Safety ID, well losing it someplace years ago, I had to register, sit for and take the test for my Hunter Safety Certificate, I did it because that was the MCPS rules and I obeyed them, was it a hassle YES, but i did what i had to do to hunt their property! If this is the reason you don't want to get an FID card, because you don't want to go through the hassle then don't do it, say you don't want to go theough the hassle and move on!
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