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Panter's getting desperate.... Stu is going to cost him his job!!! Thanks Stu!!

Sorry, but this dog wont hunt
Posted by Paul Mulshine October 31, 2007 9:30PM
Categories: Hot Topics
The typical animal-rights activist responds to tough questioning with increasingly loud tones of voice or, in the case of e-mail, increasingly large type sizes.

Stu Chaifetz is different. He's the kind of guy who can hold a civilized conversation with someone with whom he disagrees. And he and I disagree on a bill now before the Legislature that would change the makeup of the Fish and Game Council to reduce the role of hunters.

I agree with the hunters that it represents a thinly disguised attempt by the activists to eventually ban hunting. Chaifetz, who works with an animal-rights political action committee, disagrees. He argues the bill represents nothing more than an effort to give the public equal representation on the panel.

But Chaifetz is honest enough to admit that a total phase-out of hunting is his goal. Chaifetz told me he would prefer to see wild animals controlled through some sort of nonlethal means such as birth control.


That led to the following conversation:

Me: "If you were an animal, would you prefer not being born compared with running around the woods with some chance of being shot?"

Stu: "Let me put it this way: If the end result is that we had some form of birth control or other nonlethal means, I would much prefer that to guys with guns, arrows, nets and bolts through the head."

I tried to narrow him down a bit. Suppose, I asked, you were a grizzly bear in Alaska that had only a small chance of being shot, with a large chance of dining on lots of salmon sushi: Would you prefer to be born and take your chances?

"Alaska's different," said Chaifetz. New Jersey, he said, is "mostly a suburban state."

Indeed it is. And bears don't belong in the suburbs, certainly not in such suburbs as Highland Lakes in Sussex County. When I traveled there recently, I met with a couple of nice suburban moms who didn't want their toddlers toddling around the same backyard as bears.

That seems understandable to me, but when the ladies requested that the state put bear traps in their yards, the local bear activists objected. One activist was caught allegedly spreading male urine in the traps to keep the bears away.

"Stu," I said. "You can support the idea of bears wandering in the woods and be perfectly sane. But when you support the idea of bears wandering in the neighborhoods, you're nuts."

Chaifetz pointed out that we have squirrels in the neighborhoods.

"I think that what is amazing about our state is that we are so built up and we have bears, who by the way have not killed anyone in 150 years," he said.

That's true enough. And I think Chaifetz gives an excellent summation of the debate on this bill between the hunting and anti-hunting factions in the state, both of which held rallies last weekend.

The hunters seem to be winning, if my discussion with the bill's sponsor in the Assembly, Monmouth County Democrat Mike Panter, is any indication. When the bill was introduced early in the year, it called for a seven-member council with all seven members appointed by the governor. This, said Panter, would take politics out of the process.

"There's been a lot of squabbling over the bear hunt," said Panter. "Every time they make a decision, there's a political maelstrom."

But if the goal is to take politics out of the decision, handing control of the panel to the same governor who bowed to political pressure and canceled the bear hunt seems like a strange way to do it. The current system is much better insulated from politics. The 11 members of the panel, primarily named by hunting groups, have for years been following the recommendations of biologists who set the annual quotas based on science. And science says the state with the highest density of black bears in America needs an annual hunt, no matter what the politicians say.

Politics works both ways, however. Panter is fighting for re-election in perhaps the most closely fought district in the state. As of yesterday, he was circulating a new draft of the bill that would restore the panel to 11 members from a variety of interest groups. Panter's theory is that the decisions of such a panel would be acceptable to the animal activists.

"I think it would actually take politics out of the decision," said Panter. "We'd say, 'Well, it's a fair council and you have to live with it.'"

The new lineup calls for seven members to be from farming, hunting and fishing groups. The remaining four seats would go to environmentalists and animal lovers. Moms with toddlers aren't represented.
 
Panter and Karcher are cracking and backtracking and tripping over themselves in the process. From the above article it looks like the bill should be called the Panter/Karcher/Chaifetz bill.

Ant

Here's today's Star Ledger editorial:

The Bill is Flawed!

"...Animal activists are lobbying sharply to alter council's duties and balance of power."

The Star Ledger wasn't fooled by Panter. He tried to convince the Ledger's editorial board that he was amending his bill in cooperation with sportsmen and sportswomen. The Star Ledger did a thorough investigation and found it was not the case.


http://www.nj.com/opinion/ledger/editorials/index.ssf?/base/news- ...
Ant
---------------------------------

Flawed Fish and Game bill
Thursday, November 01, 2007
The New Jersey Fish and Game Council sets hunting and fishing seasons and rules based on a narrow mission statement that reflects its 1940s origins -- to ensure an adequate number of fish, birds and animals for "public recreation and food supply."

Unhappy with that mission, animal activists are lobbying to sharply alter the council's duties and balance of power.

Unfortunately, the legislation proposed to make these changes goes too far. Currently, most council members are re quired to be sportsmen who represent each section of the state. A bill by Assemblyman Michael Panter and Sen. Ellen Karcher, both Monmouth County Democrats, would authorize the governor to name seven people who merely have an interest in conservation of fish and wildlife.

This means a governor could name almost anyone, and that is too much discretion. There is nothing to stop an all-pro-hunting slate, or an all-anti-hunting board, or one made up of representatives only from urban counties or only from rural ones.

The legislation also would drop the goal of managing wildlife and fish for public recreation and food supply, in favor of a call for a "balanced system." But the term isn't defined, which leaves a lot of room for mischief.

Finally, the bill would broaden the council's duties by requiring it to consider nondeadly alternatives for controlling wildlife. This poses practi cal problems. The council, a semi-autonomous body, has no power to order state biologists to study anything and no money or staff to perform its own studies.

Hunters are convinced these changes will start the state on the road to banning all hunting and fishing. That's a bit paranoid. But the opposition is hav ing an impact. Panter now says he is willing to include a re quirement for some sportsman representation, possibly enlarg ing the panel, and to make other changes.

The New Jersey State Federation of Sportsmen's Clubs and Panter say they want to talk about concerns over the bills. Yet each side says it hasn't heard from the other, so no meeting has been held.

This is silly, especially since the federation has been open to expanding the Fish and Game Council, perhaps to include the Audubon Society or other groups with an interest in wildlife. Someone needs to pick up the phone and set a date.

But if the issue is whether hunting or fishing is a valid activity and sport or merely a cruel anachronism from another era, the Fish and Game Council is not the appropriate place for that debate. That is a question for the full Legislature.

In the meantime, so long as hunting and fishing are legal, the state would probably benefit from taking politics out of the equation. Why not leave decisions about season and bag limits to professional biologists at the state Department of Environmental Protection?
 
Panter, Karcher, & Greenstein need to GO. Everyone who lives in 12 & 14 and enjoys hunting, fishing, and trapping and our outdoor heritage needs to vote.

It wasn't animal rights terrorists, tree-huggers, or granola crunchers that were the first to preserve wild things & wild places; WE WERE. We willingly PAY for this with out gripe or objection. We hunters, anglers, & trappers have helped New Jersey preseve over 300,000 acres of wild places.

AR Terrorists are just that, they spend their time & money trying to intimidate & destroy.

We spend our time and money on the things we love, wildlife & nature. I have passed on many more deer that I've killed & I've released many more fish than I've kept; I'm just greatful for the opprotunity.
 
But Chaifetz is honest enough to admit that a total phase-out of hunting is his goal. Chaifetz told me he would prefer to see wild animals controlled through some sort of nonlethal means such as birth control.
Where will they get the money for that? No Hunters & Anglers Funds if there's no hunting, no independent revenue stream for DF&W if there's no hunting; that means the entire cost of services & payroll will have to be covered by the general fund (more taxes on everyone).

Did you know:

1. Most deer need to be vaccinated more than once for "contraceptives" to be effective? Most need to be vaccinated about every three years. $$$

2. It costs on average $800 to capture a deer to be injected with a "contraceptive". Yes, $800 per deer - per time. Add that cost to the cost of multipule vaccinations PER DEER.

STUpid just wants to raise the HELL out of your taxes doesn't he?

I can't believe that there are politicians that are STUpid enough to listen to the NJ-ARA, the Bear Group, or the AP-Pac.

No wonder Panter & Karcher are back-peddling so fast, but it won't matter come November because WE WILL REMEMBER.
 
"Stu," I said. "You can support the idea of bears wandering in the woods and be perfectly sane. But when you support the idea of bears wandering in the neighborhoods, you're nuts."

Chaifetz pointed out that we have squirrels in the neighborhoods.
I love how this idiot STUpid compares bears to squirrels. Seriously, how the heck do you compare a squirrel, which is incapable of doing anything harmful to humans to a bear which, can, has, and does attack humans?

David
 
Stu Chaifetz is different. He's the kind of guy who can hold a civilized conversation with someone with whom he disagrees. And he and I disagree on a bill now before the Legislature that would change the makeup of the Fish and Game Council to reduce the role of hunters.
Horse-noise!

When Stu was invited on NJN to "discuss" deer population control, a caller questioned his "expertise" and Stu from then on became loud and abusive. For the remainder of the broadcast - Stu would interupt callers and even the hosts before they could finish their statements or questions.

Stu has no sense of decorum in a debate or discussion setting.

If you disagree with him in writing he manages to get his tantrum across : see How he responded to Jim Hutchinson Jr.
 
JUST LIKE I THOUGHT :D FLIP FLOPPING TO SAVE HIS ASS [down][down][down]

[spy] EVERYONE SEES YOU FOR WHAT YOU ARE MIKE, YOU'RE OUT OF THERE IN ABOUT A WEEK [rofl][rofl][rofl]
 
I wish I still had the emails that A$$ HAT STUpid sent me a few years back, he was far from in control then, and that is what prompted the starting of the donation drives, which have proven effective as I never heard from him again and they are very helpful to a lot of needy people in a bigger and broader area every year now.
 
AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!

A squirrel just pushed in my screen door, knocked my son to the floor, and ran off with my cat in it's mouth!!!!!!!!!



But when you support the idea of bears wandering in the neighborhoods, you're nuts."

Chaifetz pointed out that we have squirrels in the neighborhoods.
Friggen stu-logic..... This guy really is lost..[eyeroll]
 
I wish I still had the emails that A$$ HAT STUpid sent me a few years back, he was far from in control then
I think you posted a few of those "gems" here.[hihi]
 
Chaifetz is having a tough time finding a sympathetic ear from people that can employee critical thinking. It is the emotional thinkers he can bamboozle - the press seems to have the former in their ranks.

Behaind the scenes Chaifetz must be so shrill and high-pitched with his panicked screaming that only the dogs can hear him.

Poor dogs. Hey, that sounds like torture to me. Call in the aspca.

Ant
 
Just like high school he is finding himself without any friends......
I was there, and you're right. Even became a yearbook artist so he could look over all the pictures of the normal people and think they were his friends.

Image
 
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