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i agree with liquid on this one there should be a comprimise but still don't like em in the woods cause i have had close calls with a few of them
 
charge them 200$ a year for a permit. let them enjoy the land too is all im saying and let us pay less. i cant believe you couldnt figure out a compromise?
the problem with sharing the land is that ATVS arent a low impact form of recreation. The damage done to the land by ATVS is quite evident. I am not against buying some land for the use of ATVS but this is not what green acres money, or land trus money etc. were intended for. These funds are dedicated to preserving open space in a natural setting for passive recreation such as hunting, fishing, hiking nature watching etc. They were not intended to be torn up by ATVS. Also, if land were to be bought by the state for the use of ATVS, they should help foot the bill like sportsmen do by puchasing permits to ride on the land. But until such time, why buy an ATV if you have no place to ride it LEGALLY?[confused]
 
These funds are dedicated to preserving open space in a natural setting for passive recreation such as hunting, fishing, hiking nature watching etc.
"These funds are dedicated to preserving open space in a natural setting for passive recreation " ... I've never read that. Correct me if I'm wrong, though.

It provides for recreation all over the state, including urban areas. Renovation of historic sights; buildings that are used for recreation or educational purposes; playgrounds for kids, bathrooms; etc

Read the list of Green Acres projects at NJ DEP.

I agree that the avt'ers and dirt bikers would need to pay substantial fees.

At this stage of the game, I think we should find ways to work together --- all outdoor enthusiasts. DFW will need the money, and the present policies sure have not worked very well.
 
If the state is to set aside separate land, what woods are you willing to give up? We have over developed this state and available land is no longer there.
If a dualsport bike has tags on it they can ride all they want, I drive through Wharton just to go for a ride and thats perfectly fine but when I or someone else takes their bike through there, legally you want to throw the book at them. We have evolved ourselves that if you hear a motor cycle we want to call the cops. They should make it like owning livestock if you don't own acreage its illegal to own an atv, no whining just deal with it, it sucks to lean that way but being over populated has driven us to stupid laws like that because way to many assholes living this close together.

My brother in law belongs to a Jeep club and they are out every week ripping up the SF, I don't see how they are allowed to do this and no atv's can other than being street legal but tearing up the woods is tearing up the woods. I need to sit and talk to him and find out the legality of what they do, looks like fun being out with a club, but it just clashes with my hunting lifestyle.

I selfishly don't want them to pay any fees, I just plain don't want them around anywhere.

I would love to be able to use a golf cart or quad to extend my hunting options, but I know I would be responsible and 95% of the rest of us are dumbass's and would ruin it.
 
Discussion starter · #26 ·
If the state is to set aside separate land, what woods are you willing to give up? We have over developed this state and available land is no longer there.
there are some big tracts of land in the pines. you can confine them to certain areas. if the state would run a grader through the roads the roads would be maintained. you can ride snow mobiles in some state parks. you could allow those same trails to be used by atvs .where i hunt in pennsylvania there are atv and snowmobile riding trails so i know it can be done.then things would be regulated with registrations, mandatory insurance, and the thing us hunters love most. A SEA OF ENDLESS PERMITS[lol]
 
how about a 1000 dollar fine and confiscation of the atv (to be auctioned off). the state will make plenty of money.
that's the way to go[up]
 
Discussion starter · #28 ·
there are already heavy fines and such. my buddy spent the day in court at manchester over a traffic violation and he said they had plenty of dirt bike rider violators and atv tresspasers. there arent enough law enfforcemant to cover everything.
 
It has been proven that you can not adopt ideas from other state and use them here. It just never works. Chatsworth was set aside and maintained for offroad use but you still had hundreds of riders that got bored with the trails in the confined area and ended up running all over the place anyway.

I hate to sound like a NJ basher but nothing seem to work out how they plan it here. I used to live in Va. for a while and we had golfcarts and very seldom did you hear of a problem, sure they happened but nothing like here. I really don't understand, are there that many nitwits living in this state?
 
If the state is to set aside separate land, what woods are you willing to give up? We have over developed this state and available land is no longer there.
One stupid thing is that the state DID buy two properties to be used for the atv's and bikes. One is a closed gravel quarry at the top of the pinelands. But, the Sierra club, and I think some "not in my back yard stuff" and the riding areas were never openned.

So, the parcels of land just sit there, not being used at all. They could put some brownfields to some good use.
 
the problem with sharing the land is that ATVS arent a low impact form of recreation. The damage done to the land by ATVS is quite evident
Hope I never get fined for damaging a tree due to my climber, or maybe getting rid of an obstructive branch in the way.
In Black River the atv guy's even cleared the fallen trees off their path with chain saws. They've spoiled more than one shot for me. By the time you call it in there miles away. Although they live in very close proximaty they seem to always be riping up ground and never fined.[mad] Let them ride for a fee, in places where there is no hunting allowed do to tree huggers and town ordinances against hunting. Then see who the people will respect more on a Saturday or Sunday morning.[patcheye]
 
Discussion starter · #32 ·
It has been proven that you can not adopt ideas from other state and use them here.
maybe some things like deer management but were talking about land use that we all own not just us hunters.
Chatsworth was set aside and maintained for offroad use but you still had hundreds of riders that got bored with the trails in the confined area and ended up running all over the place anyway.
you dont get it. THEY ARE ALREADY DOING THAT NOW.[wallmad] let them pay into the system and give them rules. if you purchased a zone 18 deer permit and got caught hunting zone 8 you would be in deep trouble because your out of your zone. color coded maps and zones just like we have to go by hunting every year. ITS THA:DT SIMPLE
 
I understand what you are saying. Problem is, the people that did join NJOVP were doing the right thing by joining a club and riding legally and they are the same people who I talk to that say those places are too small and boring and would rather ride illegally. Quad riders will never as a controled group pay to ride and be confined to a certain area, they want to ride everywhere.

I am speaking from experience, I sold my quads at the beginning of the summer because of not being able to ride anywhere. We used to travel all the way up to Shamokin, Tower city, St. Clair, and Shenandoah to ride because of all the open space, and all of it was illegal riding. I didn't want to do it anymore, sure I didn't care when I was younger but now I have children to lead in example.

In a nut shell, No one will pay to be confined to a certain area it's just plain boring to riders. Yuo will get a hand full of people but percentage wise it would be a veeeerrrry small fraction of riders.

Take your street bike, let them tell you that you are only allowed to ride in your town limits, or you have to by a permit to go outside of town. That will get old quick. And eventually you will sell the bike or just take your chances and ride wherever you feel.
 
We used to travel all the way up to Shamokin, Tower city, St. Clair, and Shenandoah to ride because of all the open space, and all of it was illegal riding.
Tower City is now an atv/dirt bike rding club .... 12000 acres ... just a bit west of the old parking lot. http://tctri.org/

There is a smaller coal outfit on the way into TowerCity in Good Spring (??) that lets people ride for the day for a fee ... Reading Anthracite, maybe.

The state, landowners, and the club are putting together an offroad trail from the slag mountians in Carbondale, down to the Tower City area.

I'm only telling you this because I have kids, and we've had the best times riding and camping together out there .... TC is full of families. Those old days are over.
 
Discussion starter · #35 ·
In a nut shell, No one will pay to be confined to a certain area it's just plain boring to riders. Yuo will get a hand full of people but percentage wise it would be a veeeerrrry small fraction of riders.
i own 2 snowmobiles and use to ride in lebabnon state park all the time. there were plenty of trails and loops to keep you from falling asleep.i was also told of a private land owner allowing atvs off rt. 72. i guess we will have to disagree. i think there is plenty of land and it can be done. make them take a mandatory class on safety and where they can ride in what game land or park. if they break the rules fine them or confiscate.make them sign a waiver and make it mandatory for registration and insurance.that would raise alot of state money on top of the permits to ride to boot.
 
Tower city was the only legal spot we rode, Reading Antrocite property you need to buy a 100. permit and you can ride their property.

I'm not a hundred percent sure but when you buy a new quad, they sign you up for a safety class. My buddy bought a new quad for his wife and she went but I'm not sure if it was mandatory.
 
i was also told of a private land owner allowing atvs off rt. 72.
Perfect example that you brought up, I know who you are talking about( wont put his name on the site). He used to let anyone who asked ride there and go through his gate. Eventually people were all over the neighboring properties and trashed his property as well. Now you have to be in a sort of who knows who deal to ride there.

These were people that made contact with this man to gain access and totally shit on him. This was totally free what more could you ask for, What do you think they would do if it was the state the were dealing with?
 
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