[HuntwithHonor]

I pose this question to Mr. Wells, if shortening the crossbow season is a hysteria being pushed by the anti-crosbow crowd, then why is a F & G Council Member going around telling South Jersey Gun Clubs, if Bowhunters (term loosly used) start killing too many bucks, then we will either shorten the season or only allow antlerless deer to be taken during permit season?

Let's hear you guarantee that neither of these things will happen!

Trust me, I will frame it for later I told you so

 

[nightstalker911]

I cannot guarantee either of these will or will not happen.
Some Zones are already having their Seasons shortened and Bag limits reduced. With ML season taking the biggest hit (Zone 23 moving to Zone 0 )
Thank GOD they are doing this this year ! If they did it next year I'm sure CrossBOWS would get the blame.
So it shows they ARE monitoring the Harvests and taking what they feel is proper action.

I hope that they DO reduce the Bag limits in certain areas (Bucks & Does)

I've LONG been an advocate of eliminating the UNLIMITED DOES on State land.

Thank GOD they are doing this this year ! If they did it next year I'm sure CrossBOWS would get the blame.

Though some still will BLAME Droughts, the Stock Market Crash, and even their Divorce on them

 

[rdfhunter]

hen why is a F & G Council Member going around telling South Jersey Gun Clubs, if Bowhunters (term loosly used) start killing too many bucks, then we will either shorten the season or only allow antlerless deer to be taken during permit season?

Prove it or don't bring it up... Who was it so I can call them.

 

[maximus]

NS911,you're scaring me,now you're quoting yourself and in the same post no less. Interesting behavior [spy]

 

[NJ_Bowhntr]

Prove it or don't bring it up... Who was it so I can call them

Rather than making this uglier than it has to be, sooner than it has to be, check your PM's.

 

[rdfhunter]

Ok.. Thanks for the PM...
Remeber One member does not make it fact... & I am shocked but I'm not sure of the contect.

 

[11pointer]

and crossbows could shorten season FACT..and now i hope it does so i can be the first to congratulate you

 

[rdfhunter]

and crossbows could shorten season FACT..and now i hope it does so i can be the first to congratulate you

Really how old are you?
Its also a fact that could not shorten the season.

 

[HuntwithHonor]

RDHunter;

I'm sure NJ Bowhntr told you who it is, so I sent you a PM who it is, so you can Call him out on it if you wish!

I don't make things up!

 

[HuntwithHonor]

Mr. Wells,

while I agree with just about everything you posted on how deer should be managed. Fact is: Pro-crossbow advocates have continually stated that adding crossbows would not affect the lenght of the bow season.

What happens if the Bowhunters start killing a huge number of bucks, that by permit season, they declare permit season to be antlerless only, how much money do you think the Division will lose by guys not buying permits if they can only shoot does, or they'll buy maybe one permit instead of multiples.

The more likely scenario, is the Division will let the season go on, the gun hunters will bitch till there's no tomorrow why they saw no bucks during 6 day and the bow season will be shortened by several weeks.

Remember it's all about the pie, bowhunters get this amount of the pie and gunhunters get that amount of pie, when bowhunters take too much of the pie, they have to be trimmed back! Even though eventually bowhunters will be buying more licenses than gun hunters, they council and the division will always be driven by the 6 day crowd.

 

[11pointer]

TIMMY impossible because NJ is not like any other state[kiss]

and RDF my fuse has always been short with you so we'll take this

Remeber One member does not make it fact... & I am shocked but I'm not sure of the contect.

my five yr old spells better than that...how old are you?

 

[halfrack]

It would seem to me that you cannot argue for crossbows bringing hunter retention and increased hunter numbers and then defend those increases will not affect seasons and bag limits. Sooner or later those 2 will cross paths.

In ALL of my posts I have always stated that unfortunately we will NEVER know the impact of any new weapon on the seasons. There are TOO many uncontrolled variables.

Case in point. If xbows bring 20,000 new hunters to the bow season. They shoot 5000 more animals and then the F&G moves some zones into the new regulation zone with more restrictive limits. Was it the xbow addition or another reason? Was it coincidence? It can always be argued from either side.

Remember this new "ZONE" is being proposed in the same breath as xbows. It has been argued just "coincidence" or "hedging" depending on the stance of the arguer.

 

[nightstalker911]

It is ironic how some here are quick to point out that the inclusion of CrossBOWS "might" increase the BOW harvest and maybe result in a shortened season.

Yet these same NJH members embrace adding Sunday Bow hunting.

I'm sure statistics will show that the MAJORITY of Deer taken during the Bow seasons are taken on SATURDAYS. Why, because that's when most Hunters are off. Now if you add Sundays (another day off for most if not all people) isn't that going to increase the harvest dramatically.
I've seen a lot of Posts here from guys looking forward to Sunday hunting cause they work Saturdays.
So where's the DOOM AND GLOOM that Sundays "might" increase the Harvest, resulting in SHORTENED SEASONS ?

And how about the proposal that BOW hunters can Hunt during 6 Day.

Hey that "might" increase the harvest also [eek]

There are a lot of variables that will play out in the next few seasons that "might" or "might" not affect Season lengths and bag limits.

We'll have to wait and see..

Just keep your fingers crossed that BLUE TONGUE doesn't strike again [sad]

 

[NJ_Bowhntr]

Yet these same NJH members embrace adding Sunday Bow hunting.

Okay, I'll come out and say that right now, I don't support extending the season in any way...including adding 23 Sundays to the season.

I will not campaign against it for several reasons, one of them being this will be a big victory for sportsman and women in the political arena against anti-hunting foes. The crossbow fight is a completely different dynamic.

The Sunday bow issue, while I don't agree with extending the season, is worth supporting because it's a fight against anti-hunters and their hold on the Legislature and Governors office. That fight is in the political arena, against our enemies, so-to-speak, and involves turning those in the Statehouse to our side through education on our issues.

The crossbow issue is a fight against bow hunters, not anti-hunters. It's not being waged in the political arena (Legistaure or Governors office), but within our own ranks. There is no political advantage to winning that battle, and all it has ever done is polarize the hunting community.

The Sunday bow issue is one the unifies the hunting community, the crossbow issue is one that divides the hunting community. Which path do you support?

Oh, and another reason...the Sunday bow issue is one that protects, preserves and promotes BOW hunting. The full inclusion of crossbows is one that erodes bow hunting and replaces the bow season with a multiple weapon season.

If you can't see the difference, you may need to see the eye doctor after PT. [hihi]

Just keep your fingers crossed that BLUE TONGUE doesn't strike again

Instead of worrying about blue tongue striking us, we have to worry about "twisted tongue" striking us. For example..."Oh, the survey shows how everyone wants to use crossbows, so we are going to do full inclusion". Yet, in the next breath, "don't worry, not many people want to use them so it will not impact the deer harvest". [confused][confused][confused]

 

[HuntwithHonor]

My takes against crossbows is it adds an a$$#0le element to the bow season, the I have a crossbow I can shoot 70 yards because it has a scope hunter, I want to keep out of the woods.

It's a poacher's weapon plain and simple!

Some a$$#0le who probably just got a crossbow and was practicing with it, shot a goose on the Passaic River. It's a crossbow bolt because I got within 2 feet of it. I took many pictures of this poor animal, that some idiot with a crossbow needed to take a practice shot at! This is who we are letting into the bowseason. Lazy, selfish, morons who don't want to learn how to hunt with a real bow!

Yes,. I'll be glad to furnish the pictures to whoever wants them!

This I'm sure is one of many incident to come!

 

[HuntwithHonor]

Or the welcome to the bow season filled with slob hunters.

 

[randolphray]

I'm sure 50% of ubnj members that support crossbows would appreciate being called slob hunters[down]

 

[nightstalker911]

Okay, I'll come out and say that right now, I don't support extending the season in any way...including adding 23 Sundays to the season.

Whoa, That took "gonads" to Post here. But I'll bet your not alone..

The Sunday bow issue is one the unifies the hunting community,

Yes, but if the ADDITIONAL 23 days of Bow Season (Sunday) are added AND result in a Season reduction due to increased Harvest........
Watch that unity fall apart....
Watch the Gun guys complain of no Deer due to the Bow Hunters hunting 7 day a week. And that now the Bow Hunters may get 6 more days to hunt (6days)
That's a total of 29 Additional days added to 4 1/2 MONTHS of Bow Seasons....

It's a poacher's weapon plain and simple!

That's NEVER been documented in ANY other State..

But then again the Sky will fall only in NJ...

 

[NJ_Bowhntr]

Yes, but if the ADDITIONAL 23 days of Bow Season (Sunday) are added AND result in a Season reduction due to increased Harvest........
Watch that unity fall apart....

Watch the Gun guys complain of no Deer due to the Bow Hunters hunting 7 day a week.

Full inclusion of crossbows will seriously compound that problem.

And that now the Bow Hunters may get 6 more days to hunt (6days)
That's a total of 29 Additional days added to 4 1/2 MONTHS of Bow Seasons....

It's not 6 more days. Bow hunters could always hunt that time frame on the permit bow tag. The only change is that now, if a bow hunter buys a gun license, they can use the gun tags during that time on a buck instead of the permit bow buck tag.

Basically, since it's gun season, they can use the gun tag instead of the bow tag. The change only allows them to use a bow to fill a gun tag, that's all...no additional days unless permit bow was not open in that zone, then it will be six more days.

 

[nightstalker911]

The only change is that now, if a bow hunter buys a gun license, they can use the gun tags during that time on a buck instead of the permit bow buck tag.

So in the "SKY MIGHT FALL MENTALITY" , that will give Bow Hunter who might not gun hunt 2 MORE BUCK tags..
FOR FREE !! (With an ALL ROUND LIC. )

Meaning Bow hunters can then KILL 5 BUCKS !!
Fall Bow 1
Permit Bow 1
Winter Bow 1
6 Day 2

MAN, Bow Hunters are going to kill ALL THE BUCKS !!

Look out guys, THE SKY IS FALLING !!