New Jersey Hunters banner
1 - 20 of 40 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,529 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
A couple of weeks ago Fred Aun mentioned in his Star Ledger column that the Division of Fish and Wildlife was looking at its QDM policy. Apparantly there hasn't been as many "trophy quality" bucks as expected being checked in in these zones. I hunt in one(zone 3)and personally think it is a good idea that needs some tweeking. I was wondering if anyone else has any thoughts about this program?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,694 Posts
That is what the division told us at the UBNJ meeting. they have seen a significant decrease in the number of 1.5 yos taken but havent seen the increase in the older buck harvest that they expected to see. I still think QDM is good but as you said it needs tweeking.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,670 Posts
Not sure why the QDMs arent working out as well. Great idea but not really hearing of the mature bucks coming from these zones. Most of the monsters come from the semi-suburban areas like Monmouth County or Somerset County. I emailed Fish and Game and suggested adding several more Zones.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,529 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I see too many bucks that will never be quality deer. It seems to me that if you let them walk they'll be the primary breeders. They should let shotgun hunters take one cull buck to eliminate some.
My opinion is they also need to lay off the does in zone 3
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,133 Posts
I'll be going down to Milford, DE on January 14th to a QDMA seminar. Dr. Grant Woods and Kip Adams will be there, it should be good info. Then I'll be in Edison on Sunday the 15th.

I'm in a 3pt. zone and still see the same size bucks as always. But, spending as much time as I do in the woods and fields, I have seen a rise in the basket racketed bucks.

The only problem I see is guys shooting illegal bucks for my zone and checking in saying they shot it in a zone with out the AR.

If I could have gotting acrossed a creek last year I could have busted a guy for shooting a little 4pt. that just walked past my stand and crossed the creek. I told myself to never forget my cell phone again. This took place less then 3/4 mile from the Federal Wardens house.

Ryan
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,694 Posts
Carole, the state biologist who is running the states management program will be giving a lecture on this topic on Jan. 15 11:00 am at the garden State Outdoor Sportsmen Show.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,670 Posts
We tried QDM at our club in Zone 2 about 2 years ago and it last up until opening day of shotgun. Grown men in their 50's and 60's were crying about not being able to shoot any buck and b/c they pay dues it's not right. Guess what, we took about 4 spikes and scrap racks on that opener and that is how it's been ever since...Very hard to implement on a small piece of land.
 
G

·
maybe if the state stops the slaughter of so many antlerless deer we may see some great bucks. That Button Buck that the hunter killed, just may of had the genes to be a big buck, but the state allows the hunter to kill unlimited amout of antlerless deer, and the most of you guys go for it. If they told you to jump off a bridge would you? wake up and smell the coffee, keep killing unlimited antlerless deer, and you will be lucky to see a deer in the near future
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
2,529 Posts
Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Ringwood. I do alot, mostly bow, this year I have seen about 25-30 deer. All but about 5-8 were bucks mostly spikes or crotch horns. I shot one eight and saw another. I also shot a six that was lame and looked like a double crotch horn, he would never have amounted to anything. I also see some bucks that look like spikes with little knobs on them, they may never become legal shooters. I may not see many deer by zone 11 standards, but I'm there to hunt, baby!
 
G

·
Im all for QDM....3 or 4 points to oneside. Before the state allowed the unlimited antlerless deer hunts I would see some great bucks, matter of fact nothing has changed from then till today as far as racks on the bucks. We aren't seeing the QDM zones producing like we think they should cause to many Button Bucks, and does are being killed off
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
978 Posts
Just my 2 cents, but I think in order for QDM to be successful, you need quality land, which I see Zone 3 sorely lacking. I hunted zone 3 since I was a kid, it's all state land type, 'dead woods' I call it, mature hardwoods, no understory, not much to eat for the deer, except acorns, and the acorn crop isn't always successful. I remember even as a kid, whenever an 8 pointer was shot up in West Milford, they always seemed to dress about 108 to 115 pounds, I've shot smaller bucks on farmland & good quality woods that weighed more. I'm certainly not a deer biologist, but do know that deer need quality browse, and a lot of it to grow to decent size. Just my personal thoughts and opinions.
Garry
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
18,010 Posts
If the state didn't have a earn a buck program there probably would be less buttons taken because in order to get the buck tag you must take a doe and if it happens to be a button well then? This qualifys as a doe and yes he probably does have the cruiser genes in him.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,889 Posts
Before the state allowed the unlimited antlerless deer hunts I would see some great bucks, matter of fact nothing has changed from then till today as far as racks on the bucks. We aren't seeing the QDM zones producing like we think they should cause to many Button Bucks, and does are being killed off
This is right on the money. There are fewer 1.5 yr olds because more buttons are killed during these long antlerless gun seasons, and by bow hunters for EAB. Until the state does something to correct that (and the number of buck tags), antler point restrictions will not increase the number of mature bucks over what we had previously...there are just fewer and fewer bucks each year in all age classes.

Recent studies show that antler restrictions don't have a positive impact in heavily hunted area's. They work best when the number of hunters can be controlled over a certain area, and those hunters are very selective in what they shoot...like gauging by antler spread rather than points.

When the woods are full of hunters, and you force those hunters to wait for a deer with 6 points or more, they will kill more of those target animals, and leave more of the spikes and 4 pointers. It's pretty simple to figure out...you basically recompose the surviving buck population to be more weighted towards spikes and 4 pointers because you are shifting the harvest towards everything else, and intentionally leaving the spikes and four pointers. That may be another reason they are not seeing the bigger bucks in those zones...they have put the bullseye squarely one the chest of the good 1.5 yr olds...those with 6, 8 or 10 points. Not saying a spike has no potential, but it takes him alot longer to reach it that a buck with a head start at 1.5.

Also, think about this. Bucks really don't get "big" until they hit at least 3.5 yrs old. When you shift the pressure from 1.5 yr olds to 2.5 yr olds, you ARE going to kill more 2.5 yr olds. That means there are fewer 2.5 yr olds to p [no swearing please] to the next age class. It's going to take that spike your neighbor was forced p [no swearing please] at least 2 years to be a "big" buck, whereas, the 2.5 yr old 8 pointer he was forced to wait on and kill might have been a big buck next season. If he was allowed to shoot his spike and leave, you would have more "mature" deer in the herd.

Combine that with the problem of increased button buck kills, and you have fewer fawns passing into the 1.5 yr old group, so each year you have fewer and fewer 1.5 yr olds passing to 2.5 yr old class, and of that reduced number of 2.5 yr olds, you are heavily targeting them, so even fewer 2.5 yr olds each year are available to p [no swearing please] to the 3.5 yr old class. That is how point restrictions work in heavily hunted areas. Now, in lightly hunted areas, fewer hunters being more selective would not have this problem.

That is one of the reasons I'm against point restrictions statewide...they just won't work as hoped in the current hunting environment in NJ...too much pressure, to many buck tags.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
4,475 Posts
I live and work here in zone 3. I am still seeing some nice racks running around during the day.

I know for a fact that the quality of the bucks have gone up and the buck to doe is still about the same ratio as before the three point rule.

Most of the deer in my town (Ringwood) get taken by cars and NOT by the hunters. We had three hit on Monday. The deer are here, but they are closer to the houses in the daytime where they can't be hunted. It doesn't take them long to figure out where it is safe.
 
1 - 20 of 40 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top