NO RUTTING IN MY AREA
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I have heard stories from lots of people hunting all over the State. The Older Bucks are not really going for the DOEs as they are looking for them. A BUck only stays with a DOE because He is waiting for Her to begain Her Estrous Cycle. Once She is in it and the Buck does His job, He's off to find another DOE. There is been lots of post on here saying " The rut is here, I saw this buck following a DOE everywhere she went", Thats because the DOEs are not ready for what is called the "RUT".
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No Mystic, thats "YOUR" definition of the "RUT".
The rut encompasses all the phases I mentioned before, and probably more. If you want to define the rut as a few days of peak breeding thats fine. But to say that no does are being bred yet, and that the rut isnt here yet is simply untrue. Peak breeding isnt here yet, but you will have an occasional doe go into heat, and this is the best time to capitalize on scents and calling.
You can be sure if there is a doe in heat, the big boys are on her. I saw a clear case of that last week. There was a doe in estrous in the woods I hunt, I could even smell her, and the bucks (big and small) were chasing her, and killing each other. It was pure chaos.
Define rut however you want, but dont tell other people what they are and arent seeing. I didnt just fall off the turnip truck, I know a thing or two about the "RUT".
The rut encompasses all the phases I mentioned before, and probably more. If you want to define the rut as a few days of peak breeding thats fine. But to say that no does are being bred yet, and that the rut isnt here yet is simply untrue. Peak breeding isnt here yet, but you will have an occasional doe go into heat, and this is the best time to capitalize on scents and calling.
You can be sure if there is a doe in heat, the big boys are on her. I saw a clear case of that last week. There was a doe in estrous in the woods I hunt, I could even smell her, and the bucks (big and small) were chasing her, and killing each other. It was pure chaos.
Define rut however you want, but dont tell other people what they are and arent seeing. I didnt just fall off the turnip truck, I know a thing or two about the "RUT".
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Sorry, I forgot to put in the word "PEAK BREEDING"... I know the rut really starts when the bucks lose their velvet. I also know that DOEs are like Human WOMEN, not all CYCLE at the same time of the month.
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Sorry didn't mean it that way.... L8R
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·This guy I know hunts and lives in the area I hunt, and he also says that he sees no seeking, chasing or any type of rutting action. This morning I took a ride to Garret Mtn. I saw one big 8 pointer, he would be about go mid 140 class, about 180lbs. this buck was alone, laying down enjoying this weather without a care in the world. A buck like this should have a doe with him, but he didn't, to me this shows the so called rut isn't here yet, but the smaller bucks are looking
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BHC, that reminded me of a little known fact. Did you know that some bucks (mature) dont even bother to breed?
I read research about this and found it very interesting. I figured that all bucks would eventually try to breed. However these deer dont even enter into the male heirarchy or attempt to breed. They found that these deer normally grow the biggest racks because of the stress free fall they live leading into winter. Some of these bucks NEVER participate in breeding, and others breed when they are younger, but stop breeding in the peak of their lives. They normally live solitary lives where other deer dont frequent.
I thought that was very strange, and quite interesting. Wonder if they're gay? LOL
Just thought Id share that since your story reminded me of it. Wish I could give the sources, but I just dont remember.
I read research about this and found it very interesting. I figured that all bucks would eventually try to breed. However these deer dont even enter into the male heirarchy or attempt to breed. They found that these deer normally grow the biggest racks because of the stress free fall they live leading into winter. Some of these bucks NEVER participate in breeding, and others breed when they are younger, but stop breeding in the peak of their lives. They normally live solitary lives where other deer dont frequent.
I thought that was very strange, and quite interesting. Wonder if they're gay? LOL
Just thought Id share that since your story reminded me of it. Wish I could give the sources, but I just dont remember.
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·Matty I would think that all bucks would want to breed, unless they got hurt or had a birth defect. Last week on Election day I saw 3 bucks. The 1st one was a 6 pointer, he was walking around looking, the next one was a forkhorn he also was seeking, he had his nose down like a dog, and the last one was a nice 8 pointer, he was walking to a secure area behind a house, he was 60 yards away when I grunted and payed no attention to it.
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My experience exactly.... I have seen does stop in their tracks when they get down wind of my scent pod and literally back up away from it. Non-esturus does shun ones in heat.
Matty is right, there are **** bucks that never participate in the rut, They actually run away from all other bucks and are always hiding out. I guess we can call them "HOMOCHICKENS".
I don't know if some of you guys ever heard of this wildlife biologist name Wayne Laroche. This guy is always on the money when it comes to predicting the rut. He claims that this year is a carbon copy of the 1997 and 2002 rut. He claims that north of the 35th parallel. his studies shows that the second full moon is what triggers the rut, or better yet the does coming into estrus.
To make the story short and because I hate to type, this is his prediction for this year.
Base on all his data Laroche predict a classic mid November breeding period. When the rutting moon arrives after Nov. 13 or 14, the breeding phase progresses more rapidly than when the rutting moon arrives earlier in the month. Basically it shows that when the rutting moon is late, like it will this year, noticeable seeking begins three to four days before the full moon. However, once the full moon accurs, chasing is frenzied and breeding kicks in within a day or two of the full moon appearance, rather than a week afer its arrival, as happens in years when the rutting moon appears in early November, like in 97' and 02'.
Now for the facts of this year. The rutting moon will occureed late this year Nov.16 according to him this will be the kick off for the rut north of the 35 parallel. The rut seking phase begins ramping up around Nov. 11 then around Nov 15 seeking will give way to the chase phase. Significant breeding activity will begin around Nov. 17 and become full blown by Nov. 24.
Wow my fingers are hurting hope I have helped someone here... Tony
I don't know if some of you guys ever heard of this wildlife biologist name Wayne Laroche. This guy is always on the money when it comes to predicting the rut. He claims that this year is a carbon copy of the 1997 and 2002 rut. He claims that north of the 35th parallel. his studies shows that the second full moon is what triggers the rut, or better yet the does coming into estrus.
To make the story short and because I hate to type, this is his prediction for this year.
Base on all his data Laroche predict a classic mid November breeding period. When the rutting moon arrives after Nov. 13 or 14, the breeding phase progresses more rapidly than when the rutting moon arrives earlier in the month. Basically it shows that when the rutting moon is late, like it will this year, noticeable seeking begins three to four days before the full moon. However, once the full moon accurs, chasing is frenzied and breeding kicks in within a day or two of the full moon appearance, rather than a week afer its arrival, as happens in years when the rutting moon appears in early November, like in 97' and 02'.
Now for the facts of this year. The rutting moon will occureed late this year Nov.16 according to him this will be the kick off for the rut north of the 35 parallel. The rut seking phase begins ramping up around Nov. 11 then around Nov 15 seeking will give way to the chase phase. Significant breeding activity will begin around Nov. 17 and become full blown by Nov. 24.
Wow my fingers are hurting hope I have helped someone here... Tony
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Wayne Laroche, is the man.. I have followed his work and found 7 to 21 days after the second full moon that follows the first day of Autumn.
I know someone will say I'm wrong about it, but who cares... I just keep following Mr. Laroche work and just keep writing down what I see and that will be that....
I know someone will say I'm wrong about it, but who cares... I just keep following Mr. Laroche work and just keep writing down what I see and that will be that....
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Well here is what has been going on in my area.
OCt 31 was a day and night I will never forget. I hunt on private land and there are 12 does for every buck. On Oct 31 I seen about 6 nice bucks throughout the day. Here is where the seek and chasing began(for me). I've been grunting and rattling ever since and not one decent buck has been back on the plot since then. In the beginning of the season there was decent buck activity towards the end of the month in Sept. My guess is there will be strong Rut activity between Nov 18-24.(that's with good low temps) Primo time will be evening hunts.
OCt 31 was a day and night I will never forget. I hunt on private land and there are 12 does for every buck. On Oct 31 I seen about 6 nice bucks throughout the day. Here is where the seek and chasing began(for me). I've been grunting and rattling ever since and not one decent buck has been back on the plot since then. In the beginning of the season there was decent buck activity towards the end of the month in Sept. My guess is there will be strong Rut activity between Nov 18-24.(that's with good low temps) Primo time will be evening hunts.
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I'll tell you what, Im not a believer that the rut is "triggered" by moon phases, but the moon charts are pretty darn accurate when it comes to predicting movement. I have spent the last two years closely following them and checking them after hunts. I wont say that they are dead on with the exact time they predict, but the days and approximate times are definitely accurate.
That being said, I think the rut is triggered by daylight. The reason I believe this is because of the importance of when the fawns are born. The moon phases can vary too greatly in time, compared to when the daylight decreases. This helps keep the time of year that fawns are born a constant. Its called photoperiodism, and it definitely has something to do with the timing of the rut. Im not gonna argue about moon phases though, I agree with you guys, and I think that it has something to do with rut activity as well. Though I think it has more to do with when we see more activity, and not when the does are actually triggered into estrous.
My observations are that deer activity always seems greater on days following a new moon. I think the decreased light at night effects their nightime movements, triggering them to move more during the day. I also think that a full moon triggers mid-day movement more.
I find all of this stuff very intriguing, and I can never read enough about it. Im always trying to watch deer and compare it to weather, moon, and daylight statistics.
Mystic, I agree with most of what you've said about whitetail breeding. In fact I find most of your observations to be very interesting, along with El'Jefe. I just didnt agree with how you were defining "the rut". I wasnt trying to discredit you or prove you wrong. I just love discussing this stuff......Its so cool that the moon and sun have so much to do with the life, movement and patterns of all animals (including us, whether we believe it or not).[up][up]
That being said, I think the rut is triggered by daylight. The reason I believe this is because of the importance of when the fawns are born. The moon phases can vary too greatly in time, compared to when the daylight decreases. This helps keep the time of year that fawns are born a constant. Its called photoperiodism, and it definitely has something to do with the timing of the rut. Im not gonna argue about moon phases though, I agree with you guys, and I think that it has something to do with rut activity as well. Though I think it has more to do with when we see more activity, and not when the does are actually triggered into estrous.
My observations are that deer activity always seems greater on days following a new moon. I think the decreased light at night effects their nightime movements, triggering them to move more during the day. I also think that a full moon triggers mid-day movement more.
I find all of this stuff very intriguing, and I can never read enough about it. Im always trying to watch deer and compare it to weather, moon, and daylight statistics.
Mystic, I agree with most of what you've said about whitetail breeding. In fact I find most of your observations to be very interesting, along with El'Jefe. I just didnt agree with how you were defining "the rut". I wasnt trying to discredit you or prove you wrong. I just love discussing this stuff......Its so cool that the moon and sun have so much to do with the life, movement and patterns of all animals (including us, whether we believe it or not)
.[up][up]I have been in the rut for a while now. I keep seeking and chasing the wife and nothing. I snort and grunt and nothing. I tried scraping but something about peeing on the carpet probably wouldn't bring her to the peak of her estus cycle either!!! Probably has to due with that doe pee smell when I walk in the house from a day in the woods.
Oh well time to get the bow ready for the morning even though it's gun season here. Gotta hit the hay and make sure the shaft broadhead and whisker biscut are in alignment and the release works properly!! Way to much time.. Seriously... Here up North they are starting to pair up saw a decent buck 20yds behind a doe Friday running around the woods and a buddy shot a small 4 pt that had his nose to the ground yesterday he stepped intot he opening about 3 or 4 minutes after 2 does came running through the same opening
Oh well time to get the bow ready for the morning even though it's gun season here. Gotta hit the hay and make sure the shaft broadhead and whisker biscut are in alignment and the release works properly!! Way to much time.. Seriously... Here up North they are starting to pair up saw a decent buck 20yds behind a doe Friday running around the woods and a buddy shot a small 4 pt that had his nose to the ground yesterday he stepped intot he opening about 3 or 4 minutes after 2 does came running through the same opening
According to the wizards, the doe's reproductive cycle is reset by specific amount of daylight, the estrous cycle is cued by the moonlight, which provides a bright light stimulus to the pineal gland. On the second full moon (hunters moon)during the moon's third quarter a triggers hormonal production to the pineal gland. The changes in the pineal glands culminate in ovulation and estrous.
NHBUCK wait a couple of more days and start chasing your wife again. I'm sure this time you will score, Good Luck
NHBUCK wait a couple of more days and start chasing your wife again. I'm sure this time you will score, Good Luck
So much discussion and debate. Charles Alshimer and Dick Bernier talk at length about the moon phases in their books.
I use to sell deer lures for a farm from Ohio. They claimed they could bring the does into eustrous early by bringing them into a dark barn and playing with the amount of light they would be exposed to in order to have enough supply to meet the demand for their product.
Regarding the wife....More important things I'm focusing on. Heading out to WV for rifle the end of the week so I'll have to try when I get back.. I'll have to play with the lighting in the house upon my return.
I use to sell deer lures for a farm from Ohio. They claimed they could bring the does into eustrous early by bringing them into a dark barn and playing with the amount of light they would be exposed to in order to have enough supply to meet the demand for their product.
Regarding the wife....More important things I'm focusing on. Heading out to WV for rifle the end of the week so I'll have to try when I get back.. I'll have to play with the lighting in the house upon my return.
Then I rest my case NHBUCK. If anyone can get a hold of sheeps urine when they are in estrous, is just as good as the real Mckoy. In pennsy. a place I hunt has Marino sheeps, the locals take the females in heat and put them in metal cages with drain holes on the bottom to collect the urine. You want to see the Bucks this guys get, it works!!! I have seen it myself. I even told the owner if she wanted to start a business selling the stuff.
What do you think guys? would you buy it if it works? Tell you the truth I'm going to look into next year.
What do you think guys? would you buy it if it works? Tell you the truth I'm going to look into next year.
Damn right the rut is on, I got out Saturday afternoon, and trust me, there are doe in heat already! Saw three buck chasing 1 doe in the afternoon hard, full out running chase. Also saw 4 doe being chased by 3 different bucks the same afternoon. I had an opportunity at a 120 cl [no swearing please] 8 pt. that afternoon at 12 yards, problem is, I haven't tagged a doe. Story of my season thus far.
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