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Discussion Starter #1
I tried to shorten it for an easier read....but its not that short.



CHANGES IN BUCK TAGS:

3 buck tags per hunting year.

ONE "any-buck", and TWO "quality buck" tags, issued per hunter/year.

The "any-buck" tag--------------------consists of any legal buck. (3" or better)

The "3pt quality buck" tag---------consists of any buck with 3 legal points on one side or better.

The "4pt quality buck" tag----------consists of any buck with 4 legal points on one side or better.

These tags may be used in any order.

Hunters would only receive those three buck tags per hunting year, regardless of licenses purchased and weapons used.

Once the hunter fills all three of his/her buck tags, their buck hunting is over. This will cause most hunters to be more selective in their buck harvests. Causing the average age and quality of bucks to rise.



BUTTON BUCKS:

73% of hunters would like to see button bucks (any buck with 3" of antler or less) to be counted as a buck harvest. Accidental harvests of button bucks would cause the hunter to surrender a buck tag. If the hunter has no buck tag left to surrender, he/she forfeits any further tags from being issued to him/her for that year.

This should significantly cut down on accidental and purposeful harvesting of button bucks as "antlerless" deer. This includes military license holders. *Youth hunters are excluded from this.





DOE HARVEST CHANGES:

We would like to see doe harvest limits remain zone specific.

However, we would like to introduce a limit of four does per hunter/year. 67% of hunters wanted a limit set on antlerless deer, 60.5% of those hunters agreed that limiting the doe harvest to four deer per hunter, per year was best.

However, we realize some zones are so overpopulated that we must further try to reduce the numbers.

This is where the doe harvest incentive plan comes into play;

Upon checking in ANY one of their four does, ALL hunters have the opportunity to purchase "antlerless raffle tags" over the counter. The fee to purchase these tags should be small, such as ($3.00-$5.00). The incentive to purchase these tags, comes from the fact that every "raffle tag" you purchase, puts you in the drawing for a hunting related prize. The money collected from these tags should be divided equally; ($1.50-$2.50) goes towards each of the following; (NJDFW), and the raffle prize. The raffle prize could be quite expensive depending upon number of raffle entries. Also getting a local shop to provide the prize(s) at a discount could make buying and harvesting deer with these tags, VERY enticing.

Hunters are limited to ONE raffle tag purchase at a time. In other words, you may only purchase another one, AFTER you have successfully filled the previous one.

All hunters purchasing a tag are entered into the raffle. However, hunters who fill this tag will double their chance of winning, by receiving an extra raffle number from the check in station when tagging in their deer. (the tag number and the possession seal number will be entered for that hunter)

These doe tags would be zone specific, and can only be used in the zones designated on the tag. The States Wildlife Biologists can decide which zones need more doe harvests, offering the extra antlerless tags to successful hunters for these specific zones.





EARN-A-BUCK:

Due to the above changes, and new incentive to manage the doe herd, we feel it is best to do away with the Earn-a-Buck program. While it was successful, it has its downfalls. It increases the likely-hood that hunters may take a buck before harvesting a doe and not tag it in. Where as, the above program separates the motives of buck and doe hunting. Allowing the hunter to harvest bucks, while still motivating him/her to harvest does. I dont believe we will see a significant increase in buck harvest totals, because hunters will be limited not only by number of bucks, but by the quality. Doe harvests should not decline either due to the incentive program. Also the earn-a-buck program has taught many hunters the importance of managing the deer herd through antlerless harvests. I doubt they will forget the significance of harvesting the does.



LICENSE, PERMIT, and FUNDING CHANGES:

The current license structure has nothing wrong with it, it has worked flawlessly for many years. However, due to the above changes, some alterations to the license structure would have to be made to prevent problems. The upside is it may very well be cheaper for the division to produce the new licenses. Allowing the division to put money towards other more important things.

The license itself would no longer be weapon specific. Instead, a "Hunting License" would be issued to all hunters who can present a previous years license or other proof of completing "hunter ed". This "hunting license" would cost $2.50*, but is invalid without at least one of the following weapon stamps.
*($1 of which would go to the purchasers choice of charity, such as the Division, Conservation officers, Helping the Hungry, etc.


The stamps are weapon specific and would cost;

Shotgun-$26.00
Bow-$29.00
Small game-should be included as it always has.
Senior Shotgun-$14.00
Senior Bow-$15.00
Junior-Free
All Around Sport.-$71.00

The stamps would be affixed to the front or back, just like trout and pheasant stamps.


The "hunting license" would come with your three buck tags and one doe tag. Each subsequent doe tag would be given to you upon checking in your antlerless deer. (limit of four)

This is to prevent hunters from receiving extra buck and doe tags by purchasing different licenses.

Permits would remain the same in cost, except they would no longer come with tags.

As you can tell, all the license costs remain the same, only the structure in which they are based has changed. The $1.00 fee is included.



These changes basically make hunters more aware, and selective of what deer they are harvesting. Yet doesnt force hunters to abide by strict, antler restrictions. Enabling them to fill their freezer.
 

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Discussion Starter #2
Here is an example of how these changes would effect the seasons;
===================================================

(September/October Bow season); Bowhunters may use up to TWO buck tags and up to 4 doe tags.

(Permit Bow/November); Bowhunters may use ONE buck tag, and up to 4 doe tags.

*(Permit Shotgun/Muzzleloader); Hunters may use ONE buck tag, and up to 4 doe tags.

*(Six Day Firearm); Hunters may use up to TWO buck tags and up to 4 doe tags.

*(Permit Shotgun and Muzzleloader days that fall AFTER Six Day Firearm); Hunters may use ANY unused tags.

*(Winter Bow January-February) Though your on next years license, you will be able to use ANY unused tags from the seasons mentioned above.

However, after winter bow, ANY UNUSED tags WILL NOT carry over into the next set of fall seasons.

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***Once you have used your "any-buck" and "quality-buck" tags, your "buck hunting" is over. However, you can hunt does until you limit out, either by zone, or yearly limit.***


*If you have used all of your tags in the previous season(s), your hunting for the year is over! So please choose the deer you harvest carefully. If you are fortunate enough to fill all seven of your tags, we encourage you to participate in the "PRIZE winning doe tag" program.


**Youth and Military licenses would come with 2 "any-buck" and one "quality buck".

***"raffle tags" do not count towards your four doe limit, these tags are to satisfy the management needs of certain zones.
 

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*(Six Day Firearm); Hunters may use up to TWO buck tags and up to 4 doe tags.
So this would mean that six day firearm is open to does without a permit?
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Please tell me what you think about this plan.

I would like to get the majority of fellow hunters to support this plan before approaching the division with these changes.

If you like it, let me know.

If you dont, let me know WHAT you dont like.

Have a good one and thanks for reading all of this. I know its alot.:)
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Yes...but zone limits still apply.

So in other words if your hunting in a zone with a 1 doe limit, during 6 day firearm. You can only shoot 1 doe.

if you shoot that doe and go to an (unlimited zone) with a four doe limit...you could shoot three more.

if you already used your doe tags before 6day, you cant shoot any.

this basically levels the playing field for ALL hunters. and allows the shotgunners to help the doe harvests.


We could change it though...maybe make it ONE doe during 6 day?
 

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If they doe tag comes with the license and is valid I would think the state would have a problem with not getting their $28.00 for a doe permit. Especially with the zones with 1 doe day that sell out quickly. They now go from 1 day to 7. I think the doe tag might need to be removed from the overall license or not valid during 6 day firearm.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Cant remove it from the license, but I guess you could make it void during 6day.

Unless you present a permit with it.

That makes sense.
 

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I realized that after I sent it. The tag is still good for all other seasons. I think there may need to be zone specific doe tags for 6 day, since there are quite a few zones open for does then. If I come up with anything, I'll let you know.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
Now you understand why my hair is going gray and falling out.....:D


There are SOOOOOOO Many possibilities to consider.

That was one of the ones I missed.

Thanks for pointing it out though.

I actually sit and stare at the plan and try to find loopholes.

Just so you know, not everyone will ever be pleased, and you cant fill every loophole, because there is always someone out there who either doesnt care what the rules are, or finds a way to bend them.

Thanks again though---Matt:)
 

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All the other stamps would stay the same?
 

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Discussion Starter #11
I dont follow what your saying...what stamps?


This is the way it should be changed to read;

Six Day Firearm; up to TWO bucks may be taken.
(Does with proof of permit, or raffle tags only)

It wasnt actually a loophole, but your right it would have caused the state to lose some money.


That makes sense now, right?
 

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I see two problems with this...

First, you're basing your proposal on a limited sample of hunters... at least to my knowledge, it is just the hunters here on this site. You really need to get a larger sample space of hunters to draw conclusions from.

Second, must of what you write about brings about significant changes to game laws. So let me ask you, have you ever tried to read through the game laws and figure out what they are talking about? Much of what is written in there contradicts itself... especially when it comes to deer regulations. I firmly believe the state relies on that to issue tickets and receive fines. What you're proposing may sound simple as we read it hear... what do you think would happen once the state got their hands on it? It wouldn't be so easy to read anymore. In my opinion, trying to revamp an entire deer code with one fel swoop isn't necessarily a good idea.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for getting involved and trying to bring about changes for the better, I'm just trying to be devils advocate.
 

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By stamps I mean pheasant/quail, and state duck. The way i read the proposal is the small game license is $2.50. If you add the pheasant stamp it would be a total of $42.50. A lot cheaper than the $68 and change now. Or the firearm stamp aplies to small game as well? I read it as deer.
 

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Work for change in the Code. You will have to start small, as many people/clubs will not like what you're proposing. The main reason they won't like it is that it's different.

Start with your idea to limit the doe harvest, or the surrender of a buck tag for a button buck.

You have to chip away at it.

As for your licensing ideas, that will be harder. Most of the license specific material is legislated. The DFW does have room to manuver, but not a lot.
 

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Discussion Starter #15
To answer your first concern, there was another site in which hunters weighed in.

Also I polled several hunting friends and family.

But you are right, it is still a small number of hunters. 31 to be exact....well 30 because I didnt count my votes in the percentages.

Secondly your right, it is difficult to change all the laws with one fel swoop. But if we dont try, than we will never make a change.

Please point out to me where this plan contradicts itself, and I will gladly work on changing it.

I have sorted through the numbers, and the division gets a very small portion of its revenues through fines.

Dont get me wrong, I understand what your saying, but unless you have specific concerns, please dont tell me its all a waste of time. (in kinder words)

Changes come about through thinking things out just like this, and proposing changes. It wasnt long ago the division revamped the entire system. Many hunters were up in arms, and it was a chance to be taken. However it worked, and up until now has been working pretty well. This would also be a chance, but....you have to take chances.

As for how complicated it would be, it wouldnt be any more complicated than the current set, and I dont have any trouble with them.

Have a good one---Matt:)
 

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Discussion Starter #16
mpemt,

yes you would have to purchase the shotgun stamp or bow stamp too. You ALWAYS have to have a weapon stamp for the license to be valid.

BACs your probably right....and maybe all you guys are right, maybe it was a waste of time?

But I will just write up what I think then, lick a stamp and send it away sometime next year.

If none of it takes effect, I'll just keep trying. Nothing else I can do.

I understand its a lot of change to swallow at once, but for it to work, most of it has to happen together.

Doesnt matter, though, Im done with it....

Love it, Like it, Hate it, or p-ss on it.
Its just my ideas.

Have a good one---Matt:)
 

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BACs your probably right....and maybe all you guys are right, maybe it was a waste of time?
I didn't say that it was a waste of time, but, again, you would be asking for whole sale changes to the Game Code & the Licensing structures. A lot of people, DFW included, are going to bristle at that.

BUT, that doesn't mean it shouldn't be tried.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Your right, and Im not saying they did a bad job, I think we have one of the best sets of regs in the country.

Im just trying to make it better. I know that guys in the DFW and guys like you from the UBNJ and other orgs. sit down and figure out all this stuff.

So my proposal is like a slap in the face to their ideas.

But thats not my intentions.

Its just my plans dont mingle with theirs. but they share the same motives.

Either way Im done.
Ive spent WAY TOO much time on harvest totals, revenues, probable totals....license sales etc. to care anymore.

I know your not trying to deter me. But the way I look at it....I just spent four days or so....thinking about this stuff and now I realize the likelyhood of it ever going into effect is like 0%.

Have a good one guys---Matt:)
 
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