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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Remember Friday's REEF RALLY!

What could be better than spending time with fellow anglers in celebration of the Mako Mania Tournament kickoff and RALLYING FOR OUR REEFS? Enjoy the FOOD, FUN AND COMMRADERIE!


Come listen to Democrat Majority Leader Senator Sweeney defend your right to trap free reefs! Hear Assemblyman Burzichelli champion pots from the reefs! Join Assemblywoman Riley and Assemblyman Rible in rallying for gear free reefs.

Let's show Trenton that we WE WANT OUR REEFS BACK - now!

The USF&W, NJDEP and NJDFW say the reefs belong to anglers and spear fishers - so why are commercial trappers dominating them?

Recreational anglers have paid for the reefs - so why must we endure lost rigs and anchors and subject ourselves to dodging trap markers?

Why are anglers & divers being denied access to a resource designed for hook, line and spear fishing!

Why isn't the DEP complying with the approved NJ Artificial Reef Plan? Why is the State jeopardizing $1.9 million in federal funds by turning their back on this problem? Why are 'ghost pots' ignored and continue killing reef fish every day?

We want answers - but we need action!

If trap free reefs are important to you and your organization - then attend this important event. If you missed the Mullica Hill Rally or the Battle of Monmouth Rally that helped us keep our freedoms to fish, hunt and trap - then you won't want to miss this rally!

Join nearly 1,000 people expected to attend the Mako Mania/Reef Rally on Friday, June 26, 2009, 6:30pm. Clarks Landing, Pt Pleaseant Beach, NJ (Details at below link)


sponsored by NJOA, Reef Rescue, Greater Point Pleasant Charter Boat Assoc.

RALLY LINK: http://www.njoutdooralliance.org/where/rally/reefs.html

Anthony P. Mauro, Sr.
Chairman,
New Jersey Outdoor Alliance: "We've got your back!"
www.njoutdooralliance.org



NJOACF Council Members:
Reef Rescue * NJ State Federation Sportsmen’s Clubs * Jersey Coast Anglers Association * Recreational Fishing Alliance * Trout Unlimited * National Wild Turkey Federation * NJ Beach Buggy Association * Hudson River Fishermen’s Association * United Bow Hunters NJ * New Jersey Council Diving Clubs * NJ Trappers Association * NJ Forestry Association * Society of American Foresters * Quail Unlimited * Ruffed Grouse Society * National Animal Interest Alliance Trust * Greater Point Pleasant Charter Boat Association * NJOA
 

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BUMP. Good post Mike. Lets all get out there and support all of the fisherman that have supported the hunters recently with victories in both senate and assembly bills. We as sportspersons are strongest united, working together suporting our heritage. The NJOA central region will be there in force.
 

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quote] Why are 'ghost pots' ignored and continue killing reef fish every day? [/quote]Pots have biodegradible hog rings on the vents so fish can get out. Whats killing the fish maybe is the millons of miles of monofilment on the reefs. Like i said in other posts the reefs were not put there for a select few and the state knows that thats why they are turning there back and thats why you guys lost the last time you tried to get the working man off the reefs. I cant belive you got peaple throwing away there hard earned money to stop some one from makeing a liveing SHAME SHAME [down]
 

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The USF&W, NJDEP and NJDFW say the reefs belong to anglers and spear fishers - so why are commercial trappers dominating them?

Recreational anglers have paid for the reefs - so why must we endure lost rigs and anchors and subject ourselves to dodging trap markers?

Why are anglers & divers being denied access to a resource designed for hook, line and spear fishing!

Why isn't the DEP complying with the approved NJ Artificial Reef Plan? Why is the State jeopardizing $1.9 million in federal funds by turning their back on this problem? Why are 'ghost pots' ignored and continue killing reef fish every day?
The key points are above. The ghost pots are but one of a number of reasons. BTW - it's a big ocean. It covers 2/3 of the world. The reefs are but a "pin-prick." It's not reasonable to believe that using them as they were intended would stop anyone from making a living - especially since commercial fisheren can setup near the reefs.

Why doesn't the commercial community invest in their own reefs if they are so profitable and necessary for a livlihood?

I do agree with your comment "shame, shame" but for different reasons. It seems to me that the reefs are being strong-armed from their rightful owners - an annexation of the sea.

Ant
 

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Why doesn't the commercial community invest in their own reefs if they are so profitable and necessary for a livlihood?
becuse between the state and the feds they are so over regulated they dont have pot or a window to piss out of.And as far as profit off the reef it is small but it might make the differance of someones kid going to school with lunch money that week and belive me things are that bad right now in the fishing industry ive been fishing for 32 years and im not making it. I still have a 16 year old at home thats the only thing that keeps me from puting a rope around my neck and you guy are worried about loseing a $2.00 rig in some poor slubs gear like i said SHAME SHAME
 

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Sorry Smitty, many of us know the truth of the matter and it isn't as you've portrayed it.

The reefs are currently not in compliance with the federal grant objectives for reef management. That means thet commerical traps and gear violated the the grant objective the moment they were originally placed on them.

The state is at risk of losing millions of dollars (retro active) for not conforming to the grant objectives. These "millions of dollars" are paid by recreational anglers on the purchase of gear by the Wallop Breaux.

However, certainly using trap in the area surrounding the reef - as long as recreational anglers are not obstructed - does not seem to place the state out of conformance. The catch surrounding the reefs is nearly as productive too.

Commercial fishermen can create their own reefs - they choose to strongarm their way onto what is righfully designed for angling purposes and then attack those who rightfully and legally want to access them - unobstructed.

The reefs weren't meant for commercial fishing. They weren't paid for by commerical anglers. It has been funded ,mainly by private donations and federal dollars generated by recreational anglers through various taxation measures.

Its's a vast ocean and commercial fishermen have access to nearly all of it to make a living.

Ant
 

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If half of you BS was the truth we would not be haveing this debate you would have the reef to you self. Your so full of it i think you should sign on with HSUS they need a guy with a good line of shit. Buy the way how many 1000's showed up just for your rally. 1000'S Your playing with your noodle
 

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Part of the problem is over fishing by the Commercial Industry. Look at the stripers no commercial fishing and plenty of bass around. Smitty I feel your pain the auto industry is in the crapper and I may be out of a job at any time. May be time to change jobs.[confused]
 

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What over fishing is that steve we are shut right down tell me what stocks are down ive been fishing 33 years and never seen fish stock so high. As for the bass did you know they are not resadent fish and That every state on the east cost has a commercial fishery but nj also did you know that there is a huge problem right now with bass mumbers being two hight it's called predation they are killing off the blackbacks bluecrabs just a few to mention now if you want to bash the commercial guy get you fects right just dont jump on the wagon cuese you cant cath no fish. If you or any body eise needs help finding fish just PM me i can put you on them but cant makeum bite
 

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Smitty you missed my point, I was using Bass as an example. When I was young the bass stocks were lower in my area, now that the commercial pressure is off the stock has rebounded. Why? The crab numbers are down because of commercial crabbing in the winter and you know it. They catch more crabs on one trip then you or I can catch in a year, Add that to the number of trips thats alot of crabs. More Commercial fishermen are crabbing to make a living and this has caused the crab numbers to go down.
 

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Your a riot steve they have been dregeing crabs for 100 years why just the last few years a decline? I well tell you why if you can get your head out of you ass and pay attention to what im saying its predation i will say it again our bass here are not resadents that a fact all other states on the east cost can take bass so how is there no pressure? Look at the spiny dog fish we aways had a good squid fisery here in nj not no more since they stoped us from takeing the dogs im sorry if i offended you in any whey but belive me you and a lot of other guys on here just dont have a clue when you spend 300 plus days a year on the ocean for about 30 years or so come talk to me you might just make some sence then and im not talking 8 hr days
 

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If half of you BS was the truth we would not be haveing this debate you would have the reef to you self.
You're becoming a bit unglued now Smitty. I guess the "poor me" and "I've got to make a living" crock was a bit too transparent and now you feel exposed. We all know it's laziness and entitlement thinking that gives you the arrogance to avoid facing the truth.

I have a letter in my possession from the US Fish and Wildlife Service that I've referenced in this thread. I have a letter fronm the DEP/DFW that agrees with USFWS - the reefs are meant for angling.

All you have is a strongarm tactic - the same tactic that got you on the reefs and you now expect to keep you there.

I've got the evidence that you're wrong - all you have are threats, prattle and a keyboard to pound. Get real cozy with them because because they're the only arsenal you have against the truth of the matter.

Ant
PS - we had a great rally. Must have been 500 - 600 people in attendance.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I'll repost the view of the USDFW and NJDFW. There really is no room for debate. Its amazing that the commercial fishermen are willing to jeapordize the entire reef program. Well I guess it isn't all that surprising since they didn't invest any of their money into the program to fund the construction of the reefs. When we lose funding they won't be losing anything and will still be able to fish the reefs and make their money. The rest of us will suffer as the reef program will have its funding cut and the taxpayers of NJ will have to repay whatever federal monies had been used in the creation of the reefs. No sweat off the commercial fishermen's back.



Here is a an excerpt from a letter we received from John Organ, Chief of US F&W/Sport Fish Restoration Program concering the funding of NJ reefs.

"The current approved grant objectives are consistent with the purposes of the Sport Fish Restoration Program. They are as follows.

a. To increase diversity, abundance and availability of reef-dependent species sought by recreational fishermen through creation of artificial reefs.

b. To increase the diversity abundance and availability of reef-dependent marine life that provides a forage base for important food and game species.

c. To provide increased fishing opportunity to recreational anglers and thus provide economic benefits to New Jersey's sport fishing industry.

e. To fabricate and deploy designed reef habitats.

f. To monitor reef structures to ensure compliance with permit requirements.

g. To conduct studies to assess the biological and socio-economic performance of reefs.

h. To provide the public with current information regarding all aspects of the reef program."

Here is another excerpt from the USFW letter...

"The New Jersey Division of Fish and Wildlife has the responsibility to determine what activities and related facilities to allow on Sport Fish Restoration lands to the extent that such activities do not interfere with the apporved grant objectives."



Here is a section of the letter from Dave Chanda(Director DFW) written June 3, 2008.

"Although commercial fishing on reefs is not a violation of Federal Aid to Sportfish Restoration regulations, Federal regulations(Part 80-Administrative Requirements, Federal Aid in Fish and Federal Aid in Wildlife Restoration Ats - 50 CFR 80.14) and U.S. Fish and Wildlife policy (Allowable Cmmercial Activities and Related Facilities on Federal Assitance Lands 522 FW 22) are explicit that such use cannot interfere with the puposes for which the lands are managed. In New jersey's case, reefs were created for RECREATIONAL ANGLERS and SPORT DIVERS. The Artificial Reef Management Plan for New Jersey adopted as policy in 2005, states that the objectives of the Reef program are:

1) Contstruct hard-substrate reef habitat for marine fish and invertabrates;
2) Provide Spawning, nursery, refuge and feeding area for marine life;
3) Increase diversity and abundance of marine life;
4) Create fishing ground for hook-and-line fishermen;
5) Provide underwater structures for scuba divers; and
6) Provide economic benefits to recreational fishing and dive industries

In summary, the Department is now supporting the proposed legislation in the Senate and Assembly (S-336 and A-1519). IF passed, the legislation will restrict fishing on reefs to hook-and-line and spear only at the two reef sites located in state waters( Sandy Hook and Axel Carlson)."

Does anyone else see anything in the grant objectives above that mentions anything having to do with commercial fishing? I sure as hell don't. If you can read, it is obvious what the reef program's objectives are and their intended useage.
 

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That peice of paper must be geting heavy you been holding on to it for so long. And how far has it goten you stop beging for others peoples money and get a life. 500 not 1000 and 90% of them were not ther for your rally you must really think peaple are stupit. And why wuold i come unglued i dont pot on the reefs i just know right from wrong
 

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Look at the date on it where has it goten you this is 2009 how much money have you took from peaple so far for this like i said i think you can find a home with HSUS
 

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"Although commercial fishing on reefs is not a violation of Federal Aid to Sportfish Restoration regulations, Federal regulations(Part 80-Administrative Requirements, Federal Aid in Fish and Federal Aid in Wildlife Restoration Ats - 50 CFR 80.14) and U.S. Fish and Wildlife policy (Allowable Cmmercial Activities and Related Facilities on Federal Assitance Lands 522 FW 22) are explicit that such use cannot interfere with the puposes for which the lands are managed.
So how do the pots interfere with those 6 objectives?

Is it that you can't position your boat right due to the pot line? If so I would say that is an operator issue not interference. If you get to a wreck and another boat is anchored and fishing or if divers are down on the wreck isn't that interfering just the same?
 
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