[maximus]

For the full lenth article refer to the site below



http://www.trmichels.com/ActivatedCarbonScience.htm


From this link:


"12/16/2008 Dr. Amos Turk is deposed in the Class Action Lawsuit against
Scent Lok for "diversity fraud". Is it good for Scent Lok - or bad.


Dr. Amos Turk, who Scent Lok has touted as their "activated carbon expert"
was recently deposed in the Class Action Lawsuit against Scent Lok
for "diversity fraud".


During the deposition Dr. Turk was asked to tear apart a piece of Scent
Lok fabric from a jacket. When asked if he could see the carbon on the
fabric Dr. Turk stated "I don't see - I do not see the particles"
and "they are not heavily impregnated (onto the fabric, Edit)". When asked
whether air could pass through the fabric without coming in contact with
the carbon Turk stated, "yes" and added that, "air that passes through is
not changed in its concentration of odorous material as a result of the
passage".


Dr. Turk also added that, "If air passes through (the fabric, Edit) at any
measurable rate, it would not be desorbed. Nothing wold be efficiently
purified by the carbon particles." When asked if air that has odors in it
could pass through the fabric, based on the gaps between the carbon
particles, Dr. Turk responded, "if there were any motion on the part of
the user that would make the air go back or back and forth, then it would
not be effectively removed".


Scent Lok has advertised that its fabric will eliminate 100% of a hunters
odors 100% if the time. The testimony of their own "expert" appears to
contradict Scent Lok's claims. To read part of Dr. Amos Turk's testimony
click here. You will need a PDF reader, such as Adobe Acrobat, to read the
document. "

 

[Dawgs]

i had an article on line that states carbon activated clothes are a big scam. i cant find the link.
it said it works but to re-activate it you need to bring it up to some crazy tem. no way the dryer will reactivate it.

i wish i could find the article

 

[jcchartboy]

As this story is OLD NEWS...and has been discussed at great length both here and elsewhere for years....Lets see what NJ Hunter members have already said about it in years past...(Of course we already discussed this earlier this week and virtually everyone that actually owns these garmints thinks it is an exceptional product regardless of the fact not a single one of those people stated they bought it because of any carbon claims...)

JC

Crazy lawsuit.I wear Scentblocker and I do know that works but it's not foolproof.It can buy you a little more time to get the shot.They may still smell you but they think you are 100 yards away instead of only 25.

Many of my friends wear scent lok, to me there is a difference.

Just one more thing about scent lok. I hear all the time that it's way overpriced and have always agreed. Finally got it and say it's worth every penny. The clothing is excellent quality and the most comfortable hunting clothing I've ever worn!

I use scent blocker can't say it works 100% but I still beleive it has it's benifits

I'm a believer with scent lock, and scent blocker garments. Obviously it's not the only key in being scent free. I know many people who swear by it and before this next hunting season, I'll also be purchasing some. I am a firm believer to in playing the wind. I have friends who hunt many other states and wouldn't be caught dead without it!

 

[randolphray]

Looks like the chemists nailed it, great single use product[up]

 

[randolphray]

Looks like the chemists nailed it, great single use product[up]

 

[jcchartboy]

Scent Lok has advertised that its fabric will eliminate 100% of a hunters odors 100% if the time.

I personally like how TR inserted the sensational claim above to raise the "hype" level of this article and attract hits to his site....LOL

Honestly...when was the last time anyone saw a Scent-Lok ad on TV, in a magazine or store...or for that matter...anywhere that claimed that "its fabric will eliminate 100% of a hunters odors 100% if the time."..???

If TR's claim about scent loks current advertising were actually true...Why would it take TR Michels, or even the proverbial "scientist" for that matter...to figure out that is impossible?

That leaves only one remaining question to determine if TR claims are really to current purchasers of Scent Lok products.....How many people out there, and on this site in particular, are buying scent-lok clothing because they believe the technology prevents 100% of their odor from escaping their bodies?

I'm sure we would love to hear from hear anyone here that is buying their scent lok clothes based on that belief so we can get a better idea of how much the general public really is being scammed by scent-lok...

So let's hear it from anyone that is buying scent lok clothes based solely on the belief that it "will eliminate 100% of a hunters odors 100% if the time."

JC

 

[maximus]

Honestly...when was the last time anyone saw a Scent-Lok ad on TV, in a magazine or store...or for that matter...anywhere that claimed that "its fabric will eliminate 100% of a hunters odors 100% if the time."..???

If you took the time to read it you'd see the add that was used before the lawsuit and it stated exactly that. Why don't you let members read the article and take out of it what they choose instead of force feeding your opinion.

 

[maximus]

Looks like the chemists nailed it, great single use product

Yes it seems they have the right idea when it comes to containment but have not found a way to give it longevity. To clean carbon the temperature needed is so high that it can't possibly be duplicated by a dryer

 

[red65]

The name of the company is "SentLoK" not Great fitting clothes.... Hummm[ko]

 

[jcchartboy]

If you took the time to read it you'd see the add that was used before the lawsuit and it stated exactly that.

I read the article...It does not say anything about when, where or even how often the company ever advertised such claims???...Strange?

Why would it do that?....That seems very misleading to make such an open ended claim and provide no specific evidence to support its relevance?

Since you seem to be supporting TR's claim perhaps you can tell us when the last time was scent-lok ever advertised that claim? Was it last year...five years ago...ten years ago? And if it was ten years ago...what relevance is that to today's buyers if the claims are no longer being made?

You suggest that it wrong to facts of the suit and to provide my opinion of them...meanwhile that is exactly what TR Michels is doing...and what is worse, he is doing so with a vested finacial interest in doind so!

JC

 

[JerseyJay]

im a believer that people harvested beautiful bucks years and years before scentlok products were available... therefor, it is not a necessity... but to each their own...
i dont wear scentlok, and i rarely get picked off by scent... I've seen deer wind me, but ONLY after they seen me, they used their nose to double check their eyes...

i think its hard for them to smell my scent with their nose in a pile of molasas corn anyway[rofl] my scent is overpowered

 

[jcchartboy]

Your absolutely right Outlaw!

Folks will continue to kill bucks with or without Scent-Lok...However, that clearly is not the point of this post.

The point of this post was to give Maximus a thinly veiled reason to make inflamatory claims about scent lok and those that use them as he started in the thread earlier this week concerning the Scent Lok Dream season pants...despite the fact that Matty specifically warned against members intentionally creating posts that are the result of previous threads that were already locked and/or deleted.

JC

 

[maximus]

I read the article...It does not say anything about when, where or even how often the company ever advertised such claims???...Strange?

Why would it do that?....That seems very misleading to make such an open ended claim and provide no specific evidence to support its relevance?

[eyeroll][eyeroll]

 

[jcchartboy]

Thanks for proving my point!!!

Where in the above advertisment does that add state "will eliminate 100% of a hunters odors 100% if the time...As is claimed in TR Michels biased statement? Fact is...it doesn't...So where did TR's claim come from?..He didn't just change the wording arounds to the statement more sensational to fit his needs did he...?[spy]

(If he did, that would make him as much of a liar and hyster as those is claiming to be fighting against!!....Only difference being at least scent lok provides hunters with a quality product...while TR has little other than his advice and hype!)

JC

 

[maximus]

Thanks for proving my point!!!

Twist words all you want,it's obvious what they were claiming or should I say selling,you just wish not to see it. You have just proven your ego far out weighs your intelligence. Must go to a picnic now so let the members here choose what their take on the article is. That's what this thread was about,An iteresting read,nothing more nothing less.

 

[jcchartboy]

it's obvious what they were claiming

So in other words you are admitting that scent lok never actually claimed that its fabric will "will eliminate 100% of a hunters odors 100% if the time" as TR Michels clearly stated in his article that they did?

Instead, he just took the liberty to reword what he believed scent-lok was "obviously claiming" in an ad and then to state his reworded opinions as fact?

And knowing he has a personal financial interest in this lawsuit your promoting him making such misleading statements why?

So much for this post being an unbiased discussion of the facts..[eyeroll]

JC

 

[Matty]

JC, I really don't understand why you're becoming so defensive about this subject. [confused]

From where I'm sitting, it appears that you work for them or are somehow invested in the products.

I have seen this information before, but theres no harm in sharing it again.

I'm not sure if I've shared my experiences with Scent-Lok clothing before or not, but here is what I found.

I tried scent-lok back a few years ago. Not sure how many years ago exactly or what model clothes I had exactly but they weren't cheap. I had 3 jackets, two pants, two headnets and 1 pair of gloves.

At first I thought it worked and maybe it did...I've definitely killed deer while wearing it. But I've also killed deer while wearing a green t-shirt, BDU shorts and sneakers.

After less than a season of "re-activating" it, it started to smell like wet paint or something...I think wet paint is the best description of the odor. It was definitely noticeable though. And I began getting winded more often then when not wearing it, but not changing hunting patterns and still trying to hunt the wind.

It wasn't the absolute best fit either, but it was reasonably comfortable. The jacket was not long enough and rode up and bunched when you'd draw the bow and the pants lacked leg zippers. I've worn much cheaper clothing that was more comfortable and more functional for sure. In fact, some of my favorite stuff is actually just using light camo t-shirts over warmer clothing.

Worst part about the Scent-Lok clothing though, two sets of pants and one jacket completely fell apart after one season of hunting. (granted, I do hunt often and I'm not gentle on my gear. I find many things that don't hold up to my standards. I've worn out reasonably expensive boots in a season and destroyed cheaper boots in just a couple weeks of hunting) Buttons fell off, seams came apart, belt loops ripped off, zippers broke. It was pretty terrible really!

As hard on my equipment as I am, I would have expected expensive clothing to last longer than a season.

I did sew it up and repaired what I could so I could re-use it for another year. But in my opinion, it wasn't worth the price and didn't live up to all the hype.

I do still wear the one jacket on occasion, especially for just scouting, and I have two headnets that I still use, but I treat them as any other clothing and wash them in baking soda and store them in plastic bags inside a plastic bin. The wet paint smell has pretty much gone away through repeated washings over the years.


Of course, I can't attest to their current product lineups, but after my experience with their products before, I can't see the point in spending extra on scent adsorbancy when it seems to me it doesnt work. I can get good fit and function out of clothes without the scent adsorbing liners and pay considerably less.

 

[randolphray]

The science behind the reactivation is interesting. In order to drive out or kill the odor bacteria that are absorbed you need to superheat the clothes between 200-225 degrees. I guess you dry them in the clothes dryer first then cook them in the oven and hope they don't ignite [eek]

 

[jcchartboy]

Of course, I can't attest to their current product lineups....I can't see the point in spending extra on scent adsorbancy...I can get good fit and function out of clothes without the scent adsorbing liners and pay considerably less.

Matty,

And there you sum up excactly the facts that many of the members here have all taken issue with in Maximus repetitive posts on this subject....The first of wich were not only bashing the product based solely on its brand name and regardless of quality, but also bashed the hunters that use them!...Then now this series of posts that is nothing more than a thinly veiled attempt by him to prove his point after so many members dismissed his posts in the previously thread which was then deleted after he made a series of vulgar and hostile posts directed at me.

This thread is supposedly about "presenting the facts" about scent lok clothing...then when it is pointed out that the "supposed" facts are actually factual lies made to sensationalize the issue you try to label that as being defensive? Sorry Matty...that is pointing out the truth...and after all...that is supposedly maximus's whole point in posting this thread in the first place...remember?

The facts you summed...

#1. You assume that clothes made by scent lok can not be purchased for the same exact price or less than clothes by competing companies. (Fact: the dream season pants that started this whole discussion, as well virtually all but the most recently introduced scent lok products, can regularly be purchased for excellent prices and itn the case of the dream season pants often less than $90...That is no more than any other non-carbon containing product of comparable quality.)

#2. You assume that your previous bad experience with the companies product is reflective of what one can expect from their current product and is therefore relevant to aiding the supposed goal of this thread...(presenting the relevant facts about scent loks products to those that may be currently interested in buying them). (Fact: There is nothing unique or specific to scent loks product that would cause it to smell like "wet paint" if washed and maintianed properly...I have not heard of, or even read of, a single other person that recently purchased a scent lok product and any such issues. (Not doubting that you had some issues, however I don't see the relevance of that fact to a current prospective buyer.)

#3.You also assume that despite the fact that you "can get good fit and function out of clothes without the scent adsorbing liners'....that other hunters, inlcuding those that use scent lok products...don't also do the exact same thing! (Fact: They DO!)

Moral of the story...This post was supposedly written to discuss the facts about scent loks products. The orginal post contained facts and opinions that even the original author has now admitted were not true. Any discussion of the facts concerning scent lok products must be presented in an honest and unbiased manner if the author wants to continue to even attempt to make the claim that this post was about "educating" hunters about scent loks product they may buy. (Despite the fact that you and I know full well that was never the honest purpose of this thread in the first place.)

If you disagree with the facts I have presented that is fine...state your case and present your facts challenging my view. I have no misconceptions that I may be wrong on a whole host of issues that you may be able to correct me on...However, don't believe for a second I have any personal or ulterior reasons for defending scent lok from a campaign of misinformation, bashing, and hype by Maximus outside of helping members get the honest facts in an unbiased light.


(Fact be known the only scent/lok blocker products I own are base layers, pants and a hat...while the other 80% of my outdoor gear contains fabric with no carbon scent technology within it all....I best the products I can for the best price possible...When that product is scent lok..I like many of the most experienced hunters in this country...buy it regardless of the carbon molecules that be present in the product and regadless of what they may or may not do...)

 

[broncosbp]

Who gives a shit. You can pay just as much for some other camo clothing that is NOT scent lok or scent blocker. If you chose to buy scent blocker, scent lok, real tree, mossy oak or what ever that is your choice. If u don't believe the hype then don't buy it. If I don't like a certain boot or broad head I won't buy it. I personally use scent blocker camo and have no complaints. Does it help? I guess so. I have had deer down wind and not wind me. But that dosn't mean they never will.