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| Posted: 19 Jan 2006 12:05 AM | ||
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Posts: 13094 Addicted to NJH:  Join Date: Feb 2005 |
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i've been working on my network tonight from home. we had power down all day from the storm. we just got it back up. busy as hell. i'm never up at this hour. __________________ Soccer-Mom Pro-Staffer
Hunting The Wild's of New Jersey  |
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| Posted: 19 Jan 2006 12:29 AM | ||
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WOJ,
I missed seeing you on here. Your calm nature is needed these last few days. I just ordered a bunch of Panther Martins. Get ready I'll be up in a couple of months. "35" If more of the guys on here would make post that could really help, this site would be a much better place, with less fighting. They open up fights with "my opinion on baiting" instead of "I have a good method of baiting" or What is your opinion on "AR" or "EAB" of course this is opening a can of worms. Does anybody post questions or answers to the "Moons Effect on Deer" or the "Post rut activity". I think there season sucked and now they want to complain as to why they didn't close the deal. Look at the game cameras posts, not knocking them I use one. But, this is just a piece of the puzzle, it's not going to make harvesting easier. I just don't get it, what has happened to getting the boots dirt and taking a stroll in the woods to learn. I shot all of my bigger deer, in spot that I learn while squirrel hunting. Imagine that. I believe that squirrel hunting made me a much better deer hunter. As you can see I hate blaming it on the system. These guys are acting to me, like all the bucks are getting shot up. The truth is they are just out smarting them or they are not putting in the time. My ration is 10 hours scouting for every hour hunted. This is an all year thing for me. How many have actual seen a big buck in a soybean field in August and hunted him through the whole season. This is hunting to me. Yes, you harvest some others along the way. This is hunting, not just sitting. I'm hunting him down, if he lives and walks he leaves clues. Ryan |
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| Posted: 24 Jan 2006 6:42 PM | ||
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nice post wild
more guys need to get out and scout i'v scouted more then hunted this year |
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| Posted: 25 Jan 2006 5:25 PM | ||
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hey guys- I'm new to the site and feel there's a couple factors that are being overlooked for quality deer management. First, I really like Bacs's ideas of 3 bucks per season with the option of a fourth. That makes good sense to me but why not add a doe to the 6 day firearm season? I know personally i hunt a lot of different zones and frankly, i'm not going to buy multiple permits, especially in zones i'm invited to hunt for one day. The other big problem i have is reducing older "scrub" bucks. Frankly, a 4 or 5 year old spike doesn't have the genes to be a big rack buck and neither will his offspring. But if a basket 8 thats 2 1/2 years old with a lot of potential walks in with a 5 year old spike. Everyone would shoot the 8, even though shooting the spike would do more for QDM. If you shoot the spike, you're taking him out of the gene pool and wisening up the 8 some so he has a better chance to survive. There's no way to factor in deer age into a limit, but it is a BIG factor in QDM. Down in NC the limit is 4 bucks per season. My friends and i limit ourselves to first buck anything, 2nd 4 or better, 3rd and 4th 6 or better. The only exception is old scrub bucks. A lot of times you're watching deer for a LONG time before you squeeze off a shot, esp. on scrub bucks. But in the last 5 years its paid off and we're seeing more bigger deer. Just my 2 cents. __________________ Fat Cat Sportfishing
˙˙˙ssɐ ʎɯ ssıʞ uɐɔ plɹoʍ ǝloɥʍ ǝɥʇ os 'uʍop ǝpısdn ǝɯ ʎɹnq ʎǝɥʇ ǝdoɥ ı |
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| Posted: 31 Jan 2006 12:12 PM | ||
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How about moving doe days to Oct...
Less button bucks will be taken end of the season. __________________ Former Vegan
There comes a point in your life when you realize who matters, who never did, who won't anymore, and who always will, so don't worry about people from your past; there's a reason why they didn't make it to your future |
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| Posted: 31 Jan 2006 12:17 PM | ||
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Java,
All that gun chatter would make bowhunting a little more difficult. -d __________________ PLEASE DO NOT HUNT QUEBEC! NOTHING HAS BEEN DONE FOR THE 168 HUNTERS WHO WERE ROBBED OF THEIR MONEY AND THEIR DREAMS IN 2008
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| Posted: 31 Jan 2006 12:34 PM | ||
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Matty I agree with you about AR, the hunting pressure just got moved from one year cl [no swearing please] to the next. Anyone have their 2005 hunting digest? Take a look at page 18, article from the principal biologist in the state ....... food for thought. Last but not least how can we expect the state to take us serious when we always ask to shorten the gun hunters season and then in the next breath complain about the days taken away from us. If too many deer are being harvested then should we not shorten ALL the seasons? __________________ "Wherever you go ........ there you are."
Chevy Chase |
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| Posted: 31 Jan 2006 6:06 PM | ||
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Button Bucks should count as antlered deer.
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Would you be opposed to shorter firearm seasons (for bucks)? Yes I would. Bow hunters have 5 months to hunt and it wouldn,t be fair to shorten the season for the guys who don't have the free time bowhunting requires. Another point, If the anti's start coming after bow hunting again, bowhunters are going to need the support of gun hunters. It might not be wise to piss them off now by proposing to shorten their season when bowhunters have so much time to hunt. Bowhunting is more challenging for sure but the equalizer is bowhunters get a two month head start. I think Bacs is on the right track except it should be 3 buck tags and Button Bucks should count as bucks. If a hunter doesn't like that then they shouldn't shoot the fawns. __________________ "Hunters across America must wake up to the awareness that they stand a good chance of losing their sport because of their own inaction and lassitude." Fred Bear 1975
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| Posted: 09 Feb 2006 4:06 PM | ||
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I say that the EAB shoot e limited to the early fall bow season and the permit shotgun season
Not the permit bow season. Also im not a fan of 3 points on a side although it doesnt affect me. I'd rather see it go statewide to 4 points or better regardless of side. __________________ Amateur's practice till they get it right. Pro's practice till they can't get it wrong.
Need bow work done? Arrows Repaired? Lessons? Email me at lkilr01@optonline.net |
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| Posted: 09 Feb 2006 5:07 PM | ||
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It appears to me that there is always two sides to every coin. And both sides make good points. I concede that 6 buck tags is to many, but 2 buck tags is not fear to guys that prefer to hunt bucks only and spend the money and time to try and hunt multiple seasons in multiple areas with a limited time in the field each season. The six day 2 buck season does take its tole on younger bucks but so does three bow seasons. I think a THREE buck tag limit with a THREE points on one side state wide rule would be in the best interest of us all . To me that sounds like a fear amount of deer and horn for the price we pay to hunt weather in money or time as both are hard to come by when it comes to spending it outdoors.
}}}–Paul–> __________________ Pete's Archery Service & NJH.com ProStaff ProFile
PETE'S ARCHERY SERVICE Bows repaired & tuned Custom arrows / Custom string & cables New Bows Sold and set up Call Today 201-953-6625 Committed to a Total MEATetarian Lifestyle  |
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| Posted: 09 Feb 2006 5:22 PM | ||
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| The deer management program I started to use on my property is that I only shoot bucks that are 3 1/2 years old. I take about 3-4 does per year. And I put mineral blocks and deer pellets out (not corn). Before this I only button and small bucks, since I started this I now see nice 6 pointers and the past 3 years I took 2-8 pointers and one 7 pointer. My brother last year took a nice 10 pointer. But the best thing is now I see more deer, more rubs and scrapes and have seen some buck fights. Calls and rattling have been working more now then ever before | ||
| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 1:36 PM | ||
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Posts: 184 Spike:  Join Date: Dec 2006 |
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Less Buck tags...Great idea, IF people abide by the laws. Im sure everyone out there knows someone who shoots a smaller buck and then fails to check it in because they want to save their tag for a mountable buck. The main problem we have is all of the damn button bucks getting slaughtered. In ZONE 34 (2 years ago) 41 button bucks were checked in on the first "doe day" hunt. This was just what was checked in at Belleplain Supply. That is ridiculous. This all stems from the "Its brown its down" theory. That needs to stop altogether. Another major step to getting more quality bucks would be for the state to put some of the money we spend on permits and stamps back into the hunting in this state. Where does it all go? I can name a whole list of state fields that were not planted this year. On weatherby road, they waited until the end of the summer and planted sorghum. It never had enough time to reach full growth before the frost killed it off. You go away to other places like Kansas, Maryland, (just to name a couple) and the state lands have standing soybean, corn, milo, clover, alfalfa and so on. This state sucks! Another thing they need to do... Trim the woods roads. Good luck getting to a good piece of hunting land if you have a nice truck. The roads are getting totally out of control. They are overgrown. With that said, if youre caught trimming the trees and cutting them down or whatever, you get fined. Total B.S. I can honestly say this much, If the damn bird wathcers wanted something done, it would happen. Hunters bring a lot of money into the state. Whether its buying the licenses and stamps, or buying ammo, clothing, etc. The state gets a piece. We need to get something going here. Let me know how you all feel about this issue. __________________ RACK-A-HOLIC
"It'll look good in the back of my truck" |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 1:44 PM | ||
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Just look at states such as ILL and IA to figure out what works. Shorter gun seasons and less buck tags.
Do we really need to be hunting in FEB? What about the good old doe days instead of either-sex days? The loss of the true winter bow season? Why do we have a Fall Bow and Permit Bow? (money). F&G is doing a good job managing the resources in such a congested state but a little more common sense is needed to see that hunters want more quality rather than quantity. __________________ NRA Life Member
Cedar Hill Gun Club Zone 2 |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 1:47 PM Last Edited By: bayonne | ||
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the unlimited anterless is wiping out the heard on public land and not helping the private land do away with unlimmited on public land and have it for private land only then the land owners can manage their doe numbers if needed and we will start seeing alot more bucks less deer being born is less bucks being born it should be a two doe per season limit and have antler ar state wide it works __________________ ubnj member
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:06 PM | ||
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Eliminate driving on state land.. or state wide for all I care.. I've been in drives and done drives.. Only on the last day of a hunt.. IMO I really think it's a cheesy way to take a deer. Sorry If I offended anyone, But I prefer scouting and stand hunting or doing a slow stalk..Plus driving the hell out of deer especially during the 2 day ML season makes them sitand sit and sit..
Fewer buck Tags, and AR'S for the whole state.. 1'st buck 3 points one side. Next buck 4 points on one side.. |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:12 PM | ||
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NO BODY HAS YET TO ANSWER MY QUESTION FOR THE PAST YEAR!!!! WHY DO YOU NEED MORE THAN 1 BUCK PER YEAR!!  there arent quality bucks or as many cause you guys all shoot as many as the state will allow you. practice some management of you own, you dont eat the antlers so why do you need 5 bucks a year????
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:14 PM | ||
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Earn a buck is what causes that problem Rich.
People feel rushed to kill an antlerless deer so they can kill a buck. The first shot they get they take. Granted, most people will p [no swearing please] buttons knowingly, but it can be nearly impossible to tell at 20+ yards. Who's willing to blow a shot waiting to see? You want that buck tag in your pocket as soon as possible. I know Ive killed a few bb's over the years, and every single time was a Gods honest accident. I HATE killing a bb. But the state doesnt give me a lot of leeway there. I gotta "EARN" my buck. I had to p [no swearing please] the biggest buck of my life opening day this year..THAT SUCKED...Its happened before too...and I KNOW Im not the only guy that has to p [no swearing please] bucks because of EAB. EAB needs to go away and people need to shoot does without being forced to (which is supposed to be true next year). This way we can pick and choose which does to take. Taking a mature doe can be harder than killing a big buck, they arent stupid animals, most of them have seen more hunting seasons then some of the members on here. Those are the does we want to take out. And Im not saying kill every dang doe, just keep them in check. Thats all. My thinking is this now (just my opinion, I know several will be up in arms, but its just my opinion): Keep the unlimited antlerless where needed. (doesnt mean you have to kill unlimited antlerless deer, but it helps in really overpopulated areas. Get rid of EAB so there is no "rush" to kill your "doe". Shoot a BB, surrender a buck tag. 2 buck tags to be used during any season. Thats it. Use them both during bow if you want, both during firearm, one during each, doesnt matter, but two is all you get. Now people will HOPEFULLY be more selective in the bucks they take. (unless DGFord is right and they just dont check them). 
APR might be nice too, but I think a lot of people would be pissed off enough with only 2 buck tags, so we wont go there.
Oh and I was thinking about it, Im not so sure I believe in "Highgrading" anymore. Think about it: Life with AR: A 1.5 year old 8 pointer walks by Bubba Joe. BANG! Dead. (Darn, he had good genes, but wasnt protected by AR's 3pts or more on one side) Life without AR: A 1.5 year old 8 pointer walks by Bubba Joe. BANG! Dead. There was no AR to protect him, but he's still dead because Bubba Joe was going to kill any buck that was legal, especially a nice 8ptr. (Does that make sense? Seriously...Right?) __________________ "Only in dictionaries does SUCCESS come before WORK." -Alfred K. Henderson
Will probably never kill a huge buck- PRO-STAFF |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:16 PM | ||
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I hate to say it, but unless the buck tag limit is drastically reduced to ONE or possibly TWO with additional restrictions, there isn't going to be enough of an impact to notice. Three tags is WAY too many, few guys shoot three or more bucks a season, if I were a betting man, I'd say it's way less than 5% of the hunters out there.
A noticeable difference will only be achieved with a one buck tag limit with maybe an additional, restricted, tag for say an 8 pointer or better. Due to the increased quality of the hunt, I think that in the long run, a drastic reduction in tags will only attract more hunters to NJ, thereby increasing revenue to the division. This is nothing new, other states have and are doing this already with resounding success. Single buck limits are being embraced, not shunned by hunters throughout the country. I am a realist though, and do realize that this is after all NJ, as such it's pretty darn hopeless that we will ever see real and meaningful change that would allow for an older age cl [no swearing please] of bucks. |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:18 PM | ||
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Quote:
I hate to say it, but unless the buck tag limit is drastically reduced to ONE or possibly TWO with additional restrictions, there isn't going to be enough of an impact to notice. Three tags is WAY too many, few guys shoot three or more bucks a season, if I were a betting man, I'd say it's way less than 5% of the hunters out there. THANK YOU!!!! |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:20 PM | ||
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Quote:
NO BODY HAS YET TO ANSWER MY QUESTION FOR THE PAST YEAR!!!! WHY DO YOU NEED MORE THAN 1 BUCK PER YEAR!! there arent quality bucks or as many cause you guys all shoot as many as the state will allow you. practice some management of you own, you dont eat the antlers so why do you need 5 bucks a year???? Get it straight Pennsyltuckian! Its 6 bucks a year here! 
You dont NEED that many. Nobody does. I'd be plenty happy with one buck tag a year. I save my buck tag for a big boy every year anyway. I could have 1 tag or 12...doesnt matter. One big buck that will go on the wall is all I need. I always kill does for the freezer.  __________________ "Only in dictionaries does SUCCESS come before WORK." -Alfred K. Henderson
Will probably never kill a huge buck- PRO-STAFF |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:22 PM | ||
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I posted my idea for the changes I'd like to see a while ago...I'll find the thread.
But, I agree with less buck tags. However I do not agree with shortening of seasons. I don't see the point in that especially since shorter seasons would cause hunters to make hastier decisions on "iffy" bucks. Fall Bow 1st Saturday in September-End of October. 1 buck, 2 does (More does in high population areas). No EAB?BAD. Permit Bow November/December. 1 buck, 2 does. No EAB/BAD. 6 Day Shotgun First full week in December. 1 buck, 1 doe. Muzzleloader End of 6 day-End of January. 1 buck, 1 doe. Winter Bow January 1-31st. 1 buck (If you did not fill your fall bow and permit bow buck tag), 2 does. Just my ideas.... |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:23 PM | ||
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Quote:
Are you saying that limiting the buck tag's to one and then SHOOT ALL THE BUTTON'S and our problem is solved???? Well there is nothing you can do about shooting buttons its gonna happen.....i think that it should only be one buck per year tho.....I am the same as you Rich I havent taken a buck in 4 years, and i let plenty small bucks up to 8 pointers walk by me. antler restrictions do work, and limiting the number of bucks taken a year will work as well |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:24 PM | ||
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Quote:
Fall Bow 1st Saturday in September-End of October. 1 buck, 2 does (More does in high population areas). No EAB?BAD. Permit Bow November/December. 1 buck, 2 does. No EAB/BAD. 6 Day Shotgun First full week in December. 1 buck, 1 doe. Muzzleloader End of 6 day-End of January. 1 buck, 1 doe. Winter Bow January 1-31st. 1 buck (If you did not fill your fall bow and permit bow buck tag), 2 does. so you are saying you should be allowed 5 bucks instead of 6, your nuts 
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:25 PM | ||
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| It's 4 bucks, if you decreased it much more you'd lose a lot of liscence sales. | ||
| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:26 PM Last Edited By: Matty | ||
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Same here guys. I p [no swearing please] small eights, and plenty of other scrappers. I dont NEED to kill a buck to have a good season. I WANT to...but I dont need to. (Though I wish I was better at killing big bucks, it gets frustrating)
I actually passed a beautiful half racked 8 last year that I probably should have shot. He was BIG! I started realizing that I probably should have shot him when he got to about 45 yards....I had him at about 12yds broadside and oblivious!  __________________ "Only in dictionaries does SUCCESS come before WORK." -Alfred K. Henderson
Will probably never kill a huge buck- PRO-STAFF |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:27 PM | ||
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if you decreased it much more you'd lose a lot of liscence sales. explain why??? you think hunters are going to stop hunting cause they reduce the numbers....NO WAY!!! in the long run you are only helping the deer herds with antler restrictions and limiting the number of bucks to ONE maybe 2 |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:28 PM | ||
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| I am happy to kill one buck per year and I do not gun hunt anymore. So I would be happy with 1 buck tag for myself, but I am being realistic. Extreme changes can't be made overnight. If we fixed the management slightly year by year we wouldn't hurt the lisence sales dramatically and we could better guage what the herd really needs. | ||
| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:30 PM | ||
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explain why??? you think hunters are going to stop hunting cause they reduce the numbers....NO WAY!!! in the long run you are only helping the deer herds with antler restrictions and limiting the number of bucks to ONE maybe 2 I wouldn't affect most of the die hards we have here. It would affect the weekend warriors out there. Any change is better than what we have now. Decrease the buck tags by one each year and maybe nobody will notice
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 2:51 PM Last Edited By: Stealthy_Bowman | ||
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Quote:
if you decreased it much more you'd lose a lot of liscence sales. Actually, you'd gain alot of non-resident hunters and therefore gain much more revenue than currently possible. The hunter base living in states near NJ is simply staggering and quality deer hunting is a sure fire way to attract them to NJ. If NJ became a trophy state, NJF&W would generate a tremendous amount of revenue compared to what they do now. I wish they would start thinking like a damn business already. They NEED to or they are going to perish, it's inevitable. They are sitting on a gold mine of opportunity, they just need the cogliones to make the right changes. |
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| Posted: 10 Dec 2006 11:21 PM | ||
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Posts: 184 Spike: Join Date: Dec 2006 |
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Here is an example of what the bucks look like when they are given a chance to live for a few years, and also receive the proper nutrition. I killed this bad boy in Kentucky 11/10/06. I shot him at 25 yards with the Bow. He came in chasing a doe. I passed up a very nice 6 pointer about an hour prior to this one coming in. He has a 22 inch inside spread with 9-points and 2 small kickers on the base of the left beam. What an amazing hunt!!!
 __________________ RACK-A-HOLIC
"It'll look good in the back of my truck" |
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